They are not kicking it to Milne enough

[SainterK]

IMO of course...

I had a look at this a couple of weeks ago, and after the game on the weekend, I am even more convinced so had another look.

Here are his stats so far this year for the amount of times he is the inside 50 target, his return, and his goal assists.

Rd 1 - 2 = 1 goals / 1 behind
Rd 2 - 6 = 3 goals / 2 behinds
Rd 3 - 6 = 1 goals/ 1 goal assist
Rd 4 - 13 = 5 goals / 1 goals assist
Rd 5 - 3 = 1 goals / 1 behind / 1 goal assist
Rd 6 - 8 = 2 goals / 1 behind
Rd 7 - 5 = 1 goals / 1 behind / 2 goals assist

I realise stats aren't always a true indicator of things, but it seems to show he makes the most of opportunity.

Carlton showed how to utilise small forwards very well, to either kick it to them, or to space in front of them often.

[gringo]

Carlton are a good example of how to use a small forward line. We could do worse than to use Schnides, Milne and Peake the way they use Betts, Garlett and Yarran. They all know how to get a goal and they are no great loss around the ground, at least it would be entertaining.

It would be a good alternative to robbing the backline.

[SaintTom]

Carlton are a good example of how to use a small forward line. We could do worse than to use Schnides, Milne and Peake the way they use Betts, Garlett and Yarran. They all know how to get a goal and they are no great loss around the ground, at least it would be entertaining.

It would be a good alternative to robbing the backline.

Very good point. Unfortunately we had to use Schieds in defence a bit on the weekend to combat the small Carlton forwards that were running rings around our defenders. On the whole though, I think this is the most viable option for getting goals I have seen so far.

[SainterK]

Need to kick it to them, or to space though!

I don't subscribe to the nothing to kick it to theory (sorry bigcarl) and they should be kicking it to the advantage of our smalls more often.

[Saintsfan]

Milne is in very good form at the moment so it would not be the worst thing to attempt to look for him more often.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

i think we are looking for him but we tend to kick it in the air to him where he gets beatn by the taller defender ... we nned to kick it to kosi with milne at his feet to pick it up if kosi drops it

[plugger66]

We cant use our forwards like Carlton. They are fast so they can kick to open spaces. ours are clever but arent fast.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

We cant use our forwards like Carlton. They are fast so they can kick to open spaces. ours are clever but arent fast.

exactly gotta play to our strengths and milne as a marking forward isnt the answer he lives off the crumbing goal he is at his most dangerous when he is picking up the scraps

[dcstkfc]

We cant use our forwards like Carlton. They are fast so they can kick to open spaces. ours are clever but arent fast.

exactly gotta play to our strengths and milne as a marking forward isnt the answer he lives off the crumbing goal he is at his most dangerous when he is picking up the scraps

Why can't Kosi contest more, so that he can get the spills and Milney and Schneids can pounce, with Mini and Steven applying pressure to keep it in.

We could really do with an Alwyn Davey.

[SainterK]

We cant use our forwards like Carlton. They are fast so they can kick to open spaces. ours are clever but arent fast.

exactly gotta play to our strengths and milne as a marking forward isnt the answer he lives off the crumbing goal he is at his most dangerous when he is picking up the scraps

Disagree, but that's OK...

I think he is capable of more than crumbs, his game against Freo was a perfect example of that.

[Finna]

Carlton are a good example of how to use a small forward line. We could do worse than to use Schnides, Milne and Peake the way they use Betts, Garlett and Yarran. They all know how to get a goal and they are no great loss around the ground, at least it would be entertaining.

It would be a good alternative to robbing the backline.

Great Post. Definitely worth a try.

[spert]

Don't use Carlton as an example of how to play football..they crept up on the comps two best teams, Geelong and the Saints and caught them napping. They wont get that luxury again this season.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

We cant use our forwards like Carlton. They are fast so they can kick to open spaces. ours are clever but arent fast.

exactly gotta play to our strengths and milne as a marking forward isnt the answer he lives off the crumbing goal he is at his most dangerous when he is picking up the scraps

Why can't Kosi contest more, so that he can get the spills and Milney and Schneids can pounce, with Mini and Steven applying pressure to keep it in.

We could really do with an Alwyn Davey.

i think Kosi is contesting fine .. it think the issue is when he get beaten in the air there is noone at the fall of the ball


we could really do with an andrew Lovett right now but hey we all know that aint gunna happen

[ace]

We cant use our forwards like Carlton. They are fast so they can kick to open spaces. ours are clever but arent fast.

exactly gotta play to our strengths and milne as a marking forward isnt the answer he lives off the crumbing goal he is at his most dangerous when he is picking up the scraps

Why can't Kosi contest more, so that he can get the spills and Milney and Schneids can pounce, with Mini and Steven applying pressure to keep it in.

We could really do with an Alwyn Davey.

i think Kosi is contesting fine .. it think the issue is when he get beaten in the air there is noone at the fall of the ball


we could really do with an andrew Lovett right now but hey we all know that aint gunna happen

We could really do even better with a Nick Riewoldt right now but hey we all know that aint gunna happen soon.

[SainterK]

Given he is fast approaching his 200th game, I thought I would update this thread.

Here are his updated stats so far this year for the amount of times he is the inside 50 target, his return, and his goal assists.

Rd 1 - 2 times = 1 goals / 1 behind
Rd 2 - 6 times = 3 goals / 2 behinds
Rd 3 - 6 times = 1 goals/ 1 goal assist
Rd 4 - 13 times = 5 goals / 1 goal assist
Rd 5 - 3 times = 1 goals / 1 behind / 1 goal assist
Rd 6 - 8 times = 2 goals / 1 behind
Rd 7 - 5 times = 1 goals / 1 behind / 2 goals assists
Rd 8 - 6 times = 1 goal / 2 behinds / 1 goal assist
Rd 9 - 5 times = 3 goals / 1 behind
Rd 10 - 3 times = 3 goals / 1 behind / 3 goals assists

Seems like our tall forward structure allowed him to crumb on the weekend, he had a part in 6 goals and was only the target 3 times, which is great IMO.

[Griggsy]

Nice stats but can you be sure those goals were scored from him being the target. I'd say quite a few were from Milne doing what Milne does best, being a goal sneak

[SainterK]

Nice stats but can you be sure those goals were scored from him being the target. I'd say quite a few were from Milne doing what Milne does best, being a goal sneak

I understand that could be the case Griggsy, but not sure he has the opportunity for opportunist goals so much in recent weeks?

With Roo out, I think he has been a target in his own right, that was why I wanted to highlight this effort.

Even commentators have remarked on his ability to out body his opponent in a marking contest, sure he may not even mark it, but his opponent generally won't either...and he tends to win the battle once it hits the ground.

[Milan Faletic]

We cant use our forwards like Carlton. They are fast so they can kick to open spaces. ours are clever but arent fast.

exactly gotta play to our strengths and milne as a marking forward isnt the answer he lives off the crumbing goal he is at his most dangerous when he is picking up the scraps

Why can't Kosi contest more, so that he can get the spills and Milney and Schneids can pounce, with Mini and Steven applying pressure to keep it in.

We could really do with an Alwyn Davey.

i think Kosi is contesting fine .. it think the issue is when he get beaten in the air there is noone at the fall of the ball


we could really do with an andrew Lovett right now but hey we all know that aint gunna happen

I agree with two points, Kosi should contest more on the lead and not always jump from the back.

There should be crumbers at the fall of the ball.

I personally think Kosi's team mates don't have confidence in him at the moment and can't read him.

He leads to the wrong space and leads either too early when the ball is close to 50 or too late when the ball is on the wing. Sometimes he doesn't lead at all. I think he is causing confusion to the midfielders who are running up the ground looking for a Roo type lead to link to the forwards and that is why we are handballing more. Kosi has to know when to come up the ground and when to play deep. I just don't think he knows. Even if he leads early and then doubles back for the kick into space, that would be ok.

I love that our midfielders are having a go from 50. There is no use having 60 odd Inside 50's like we did in the GF and kick 9 goals. Long goals have been missing from our game since the PF last year and finally it is happening again. Those goals from Joey, BJ, Mini and Dal are team lifters.

I think in the last quarter last week we had 12 Inside 50's for 7 goals 3. Adelaide had 10 Inside 50's for 1 goal. How many of those were contested marks by a tall forward followed by a set shot?

[rexy]

i think we are looking for him but we tend to kick it in the air to him where he gets beatn by the taller defender ... we nned to kick it to kosi with milne at his feet to pick it up if kosi drops it

This

[saint66au]

i think we are looking for him but we tend to kick it in the air to him where he gets beatn by the taller defender ... we nned to kick it to kosi with milne at his feet to pick it up if kosi drops it

This

Kind of agree

We are kicking it to Milne one-out in the hope that his bag of tricks will be enough to evade his opponent at the enevitable spill of the ball. He does pretty much always lead to the pocket though, so a ball with too much air just gets smashed out of bounds.

I agree though that Milney should be at Kosi's feet more often, however quite often he's providing the "B" lead in the pocket and its left to Mini, Schneider and any onballers to contest the crumbs

[St Ick]

We cant use our forwards like Carlton. They are fast so they can kick to open spaces. ours are clever but arent fast.

exactly gotta play to our strengths and milne as a marking forward isnt the answer he lives off the crumbing goal he is at his most dangerous when he is picking up the scraps

Couldn't agree more, of his career goals, how many are from crumbing? I'd love to know that stat but thats where he is at his best - Kosi just needs to get hands to it and make sure it goes to ground. Milne will more often than not do the rest, its a scary day when our focal point up forward is Stevie Milne - love the bloke, but he is and always will be doing his best work at the feet of the power forward.

[Thinline]

We cant use our forwards like Carlton. They are fast so they can kick to open spaces. ours are clever but arent fast.

exactly gotta play to our strengths and milne as a marking forward isnt the answer he lives off the crumbing goal he is at his most dangerous when he is picking up the scraps

Why can't Kosi contest more, so that he can get the spills and Milney and Schneids can pounce, with Mini and Steven applying pressure to keep it in.

We could really do with an Alwyn Davey.

i think Kosi is contesting fine .. it think the issue is when he get beaten in the air there is noone at the fall of the ball


we could really do with an andrew Lovett right now but hey we all know that aint gunna happen

I agree with two points, Kosi should contest more on the lead and not always jump from the back.

There should be crumbers at the fall of the ball.

I personally think Kosi's team mates don't have confidence in him at the moment and can't read him.

He leads to the wrong space and leads either too early when the ball is close to 50 or too late when the ball is on the wing. Sometimes he doesn't lead at all. I think he is causing confusion to the midfielders who are running up the ground looking for a Roo type lead to link to the forwards and that is why we are handballing more. Kosi has to know when to come up the ground and when to play deep. I just don't think he knows. Even if he leads early and then doubles back for the kick into space, that would be ok.

Up here I've been watching Gold Coast Footy Club go through their (early) paces. They have been okay too. Defensively they really have a crack, but they're really struggling for system up forward. They've been using Nathan Ablett as a key target and another kid called Charlie Dixon (incidentally he wears the no 23). Anyway my point is this. Everyone's been shitcanning both of them but particularly Ablett. But fact is he's been busting his arse running to ignored space, banging into people, and generally getting tangled up in a whole lot of really clumsy looking half-contests. But the indisputable fact is he's running himself ragged trying to be a key target when in the past he was always second foil to Mooney et al. Now I know the VFL is a far cry away, but I believe the principle is generally the same. Only we've got a big lumbering bloke trying to be Roo, himself and ruckman all at once. It's no picnic. And his effort is sound. I agree with the club on this. Once his effort starts getting rewarded - once a couple of pack grabs stick - he'll be a radically improved player, one of the type that was so handy last year. And to be honest, as a guy whose traditionally gone in bursts, I;'d much prefer him to be due to go bang in Rds 14-25 than now. Besides, talk of him not being there is academic. There is no one who can properly replace him. And King is over. So I say get on with it. Kosi-watch is wasted time. Go 23. Make them choke on their negativity.

[bigcarl]

Given he is fast approaching his 200th game, I thought I would update this thread.

Here are his updated stats so far this year for the amount of times he is the inside 50 target, his return, and his goal assists.

Rd 1 - 2 times = 1 goals / 1 behind
Rd 2 - 6 times = 3 goals / 2 behinds
Rd 3 - 6 times = 1 goals/ 1 goal assist
Rd 4 - 13 times = 5 goals / 1 goal assist
Rd 5 - 3 times = 1 goals / 1 behind / 1 goal assist
Rd 6 - 8 times = 2 goals / 1 behind
Rd 7 - 5 times = 1 goals / 1 behind / 2 goals assists
Rd 8 - 6 times = 1 goal / 2 behinds / 1 goal assist
Rd 9 - 5 times = 3 goals / 1 behind
Rd 10 - 3 times = 3 goals / 1 behind / 3 goals assists

Seems like our tall forward structure allowed him to crumb on the weekend, he had a part in 6 goals and was only the target 3 times, which is great IMO.

i'd like to see kosi's efficiency rating this season expressed as a percentage.

ie, how many times we go to him up against how many times he gets it and kicks a goal.

he is, after all, the senior key forward and the main aerial target.

i think he should be playing ruck, but unfortunately GT isn't helping kosi's case by suggesting this more than once.

unlikely ross is going to be seen to be taking direction from the old coach.

that's a shame because it's the quickest way i can see kosi returning to the form we know he is capable of. he's likely to contribute much more in that position.

[SainterK]

It takes awhile to put it all together bigcarl, so I have only put together the last 3 rounds for now and have also included the small forwards output as well.

Rd 8 - 12 times - 3 goals / 2 behinds - 2 opportunists goals
Rd 9 - 7 times - 1 goal / 1 behind - 5 opportunist goals
Rd 10 - 8 times - 1 behind - 7 opportunist goals

[bigcarl]

It takes awhile to put it all together bigcarl, so I have only put together the last 3 rounds for now and have also included the small forwards output as well.

Rd 8 - 12 times - 3 goals / 2 behinds - 2 opportunists goals
Rd 9 - 7 times - 1 goal / 1 behind - 5 opportunist goals
Rd 10 - 8 times - 1 behind - 7 opportunist goals

sorry k, didn't mean to put you to any trouble.

i don't need to see stats to see that kosi has been ineffective this season in so far as kicking goals. he brings the ball to ground, sure, but is that enough from a ff?

the stat i'm most interested in is number of forward 50 entries turned into goals as compared to other teams.

i'll keep an eye on them myself if you tell me where to get the information.