Whispers in the sky

[jays]

this explains so much

[BarryGrogan]

GT talks about the umpires putting their egos in their back pocket. Maybe he should have taken his own advice. He represented the SKFC not himself. Makes us all warm and fuzzy that he stuck it to City Hall but where did it get us? How did it help StKilda? For mine it shows how dumb GT was and what an egomaniac he was/is.

It's an interesting point.

What's to gain by fighting with the AFL? It feels good, but it's kind of like telling your boss to f*** off. In the long run, is it really going to help? Or hinder you?

As a supporter, would you rather a club that is 'sticking up for itself' whilst being rodgered at every turn for for being insolent?
Or a club that bends over and cops it - but isn't on the receiving end of the AFL's vindictiveness?

I’d rather we not bend over for anyone. Prefer the club to be respected and not pushovers

Personally, I think the only options are:

1) bend over and take whatever is coming or..
2) bend over and take whatever is coming but then whinge to the media about it


Either way you're copping whatever the AFL want to give you.

[Moods]

GT talks about the umpires putting their egos in their back pocket. Maybe he should have taken his own advice. He represented the SKFC not himself. Makes us all warm and fuzzy that he stuck it to City Hall but where did it get us? How did it help StKilda? For mine it shows how dumb GT was and what an egomaniac he was/is.

It's an interesting point.

What's to gain by fighting with the AFL? It feels good, but it's kind of like telling your boss to f*** off. In the long run, is it really going to help? Or hinder you?

As a supporter, would you rather a club that is 'sticking up for itself' whilst being rodgered at every turn for for being insolent?
Or a club that bends over and cops it - but isn't on the receiving end of the AFL's vindictiveness?

For mine it showed a distinct lack of intelligence and awareness. How did GT think the AFL were going to respond and especially the umpires, when he attacks them personally? Not saying that this excuses the umpires but bloody hell, 3 x weeks out from finals and he picks a war with the AFL? He is not an unintelligent guy so it really was one of the most selfish things that he could do - akin to morons running on the field after Gehrig kicked his 100th in the prelim.

I'm not a GT hater by the way. What he did for the club was incredible between 03-05 but his ego always got in the way. He always said that if someone better came along he would step aside. What a laugh! He was never stepping aside, for anyone. And in terms of knowledge and understanding of the modern game he wasn't a patch on Lyon. Halfway through 09 I recall reading GT's remarks where he conceded that no way he could have the team playing like it was at that time.

History appears to have been very kind to GT on here. I recall at the time ppl were screaming for his removal and he was the worst coach ever - now he is a true Saints man who we need more of. Basically he wasn't nearly as savvy a media performer as he liked to think he was. He attacked Sam Newman and the FS and that was fair enough. I reckon he got ahead of himself after that. Sam apologised and I reckon he thought he was king of the world. You don't publicly attack umpires if you have half a brain. Us emotional footy supporters love it because we feel we're being ripped off every week. You don't employ people to make emotional decisions on behalf of your organisation.

[Ghost Like]

Could he be our Jeff Kennett?

You might hate him, but he rocks the boat and ensures Hawthorn’s relevance.

It appears GT rocked the boat and ensured our irrelevance.

[B.M]

Always stand up for your convictions

That’s how you earn respect

If the AFL lack integrity and purposefully make life difficult by being unfair, call that out too.

I’m all for sticking it to the man, if it’s warranted/deserved

[older saint]

AD was all about AD and bonus for TV Rights, hence why he left after it was signed. Look at what happened with the business he was advising for recently......

Thomas was all about StKilda. Lacked tactical nous to get us over the line , no plan B and ran the young guys into the ground too much early on - injuries to Kosi, Ball Maguire but was always about Stkilda

[Greg T]

Listen to | Grant Thomas - Saint or Sinner? from SACKED in Podcasts. https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/s ... 9dc335577f

Really worth a listen

Talks about the 2004-2005 preliminary final losses. Says he could have responded better at three quarter time in 2005 after Hall’s hit on Maguire.

Says Sirengate cost us the double chance that year. The club had QCs lined up saying we had a case, but then didn’t want to pursue it.

Tips a bucket on Demetriou. Suggests that, at best, the then AFL CEO had a complete lack of respect for our club.

Is coy about Buttress, but says a meeting at the end of 2003 after he and the players returned from London was the tipping point in their relationship.

Talks about his sacking and how it unfolded.

Says he backed Blight to the hilt in his role as football director and was literally the last to know of plans to remove him.

Nominates the best mark he’s seen, Riewoldt against Sydney in 2004. Also lauds the courage of Lenny, Kosi, Jason Blake, Baker and others.

Talks about St Kilda’s culture over 150 years and what we need to do to achieve success.

Laments where the club is at.

Anyhow, great interview, runs about 45 minutes

Thanks for the link was very interesting,what an insight

[Moods]

Always stand up for your convictions

That’s how you earn respect

If the AFL lack integrity and purposefully make life difficult by being unfair, call that out too.

I’m all for sticking it to the man, if it’s warranted/deserved

You pick your battles. That's how the war is won.

Interesting that Bomber supporters also thought that they were being persecuted at the time. They wanted someone who would 'stick up for the bombers' and not a yes man to the AFL. How did their respect level go as a result? They were on a hiding to nothing I know but if they had taken their medicine and stuck their hands up the level of respect would be far higher. Emotional footy supporters love it because they think, this is what I want to tell the AFL.
What about Tony Cochrane at the Suns? He rants and raves and is treated like he class clown.

Sometimes you need some awareness of what's going on rather than going off half cocked. I reckon Nathan Buckley could school GT in how to handle the media. He bites back to defend his players when required but is very measured in everything he says.

[Greg T]

Listen to | Grant Thomas - Saint or Sinner? from SACKED in Podcasts. https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/s ... 9dc335577f

Really worth a listen

Talks about the 2004-2005 preliminary final losses. Says he could have responded better at three quarter time in 2005 after Hall’s hit on Maguire.

Says Sirengate cost us the double chance that year. The club had QCs lined up saying we had a case, but then didn’t want to pursue it.

Tips a bucket on Demetriou. Suggests that, at best, the then AFL CEO had a complete lack of respect for our club.

Is coy about Buttress, but says a meeting at the end of 2003 after he and the players returned from London was the tipping point in their relationship.

Talks about his sacking and how it unfolded.

Says he backed Blight to the hilt in his role as football director and was literally the last to know of plans to remove him.

Nominates the best mark he’s seen, Riewoldt against Sydney in 2004. Also lauds the courage of Lenny, Kosi, Jason Blake, Baker and others.

Talks about St Kilda’s culture over 150 years and what we need to do to achieve success.

Laments where the club is at.

Anyhow, great interview, runs about 45 minutes

Thanks for the link was very interesting,what an insight

Cheers for the link,love him or hate him the one thing he’s right about ,our time is now to be bolder than ever
Get the best there is

[B.M]

I pick my battles with those who want to have crack at me, I don’t just look for battles I can win.

That’s the difference between a bully and a person who just stands up for themselves

StK is not well respected because it rolls over and accepts mediocrity

[desertsaint]

For all his knockers just think what we were and what we achieved under gt.
From woodenspooners to legitimate and exciting contenders. Sure we had some top picks but so have the deed, blues, and suns. Most of our group were lower rungs and trades. And before they’d got near their peak he took them to 2 prelims.
Lyon had the likes of roo, Goddard, Hayes, Joey, chips, Baker, Milney et al over their prime football ages. It was GT’s team. But where gt played youth Ross left the likes of Steven and Armo stewing in the seconds.
I’d give anything to have another gt right now. Surely we all would.

[Moods]

I pick my battles with those who want to have crack at me, I don’t just look for battles I can win.

That’s the difference between a bully and a person who just stands up for themselves

StK is not well respected because it rolls over and accepts mediocrity

That's rubbish. St Kilda are crap for a whole range of reasons, not because we don't challenge the AFL at every turn. There's such a thing as a person who's a perpetual victim as well. They believe they're standing up for themselves, but everyone else just sees them as a whiner.

Peter Gordon was a strong president who stood up for the doggies, but he was smart about it

[SAINT-LEE]

Don't complain about umpires.

It's in the past and you can't change history

Swings and roundabouts etc

Kick 20 goals and it's....umpire who?

[B.M]

I didn’t say crap, that’s because we have a horrible list thanks to

Chris Pelchen, Tony Elshaugh

I said we are not respected. To be respected to stand up for what is right, and not bend over. And we accept mediocrity

[BarryGrogan]

I didn’t say crap, that’s because we have a horrible list thanks to

Chris Pelchen, Tony Elshaugh

I said we are not respected. To be respected to stand up for what is right, and not bend over. And we accept mediocrity

I don't actually agree with any of that.

Who should we have recruited, that we didn't?

Who stands up for what is right in the AFL? And Given it's an entertainment business - who's to say what is right anyway?

And what does accepting mediocrity mean anyway?

Do you really think people that work at the club don't want to win?



I personally think the whole of what you're talking about died about 30 years in AFL footy.

[Ghost Like]

I pick my battles with those who want to have crack at me, I don’t just look for battles I can win.

That’s the difference between a bully and a person who just stands up for themselves

StK is not well respected because it rolls over and accepts mediocrity

I think it's the art of war B.M.. Pick your battles, win the war. Park the ego, look at the here and now, what needs resources and what is a distraction not needed all with an eye on the future.

Interesting you use the word bully, I would be surprised if there weren't a number of people out there who would describe G.T. as exactly that.

[B.M]

We shouldn’t have down traded picks 12 & 13 if we were going to let go a star, why would you let go an elite, then downgrade the pick you get, to make it harder to replace 5he talent?! Recruiting madness.

We shouldn’t have downtraded pick 20

We should have definitely kept Ben McEvoy, and possibly Stanley.

Because we let go those two ruckmen about to come into their prime, we had to give away our Da Santo compensation p25 for Billy Longer. Now there is a monumental stuff up.

We should have tried to hang on to Lynch, after 3 years of development, poor dev it must be said. But convince him a new coach will give him opportunities, or 5hey didn’t rate him, which was a mistake

We should have taken best available in 2014 and not worry about the impending retirement of Nick, or the Tom Boyd contract.

Going back further
Pattison, Polo, Gamble, J.Smith
Winmar, Johnson

[bigcarl]

For all his knockers just think what we were and what we achieved under gt.
From woodenspooners to legitimate and exciting contenders. Sure we had some top picks but so have the deed, blues, and suns. Most of our group were lower rungs and trades. And before they’d got near their peak he took them to 2 prelims.
Lyon had the likes of roo, Goddard, Hayes, Joey, chips, Baker, Milney et al over their prime football ages. It was GT’s team. But where gt played youth Ross left the likes of Steven and Armo stewing in the seconds.
I’d give anything to have another gt right now. Surely we all would.

This

[BarryGrogan]

We shouldn’t have down traded picks 12 & 13 if we were going to let go a star, why would you let go an elite, then downgrade the pick you get, to make it harder to replace 5he talent?! Recruiting madness.

We shouldn’t have downtraded pick 20

We should have definitely kept Ben McEvoy, and possibly Stanley.

Because we let go those two ruckmen about to come into their prime, we had to give away our Da Santo compensation p25 for Billy Longer. Now there is a monumental stuff up.

We should have tried to hang on to Lynch, after 3 years of development, poor dev it must be said. But convince him a new coach will give him opportunities, or 5hey didn’t rate him, which was a mistake

We should have taken best available in 2014 and not worry about the impending retirement of Nick, or the Tom Boyd contract.

Going back further
Pattison, Polo, Gamble, J.Smith
Winmar, Johnson

So we'd be really good with McEvoy, Stanley and Dal Santo and Lynch?

Who should have we got with those picks?

[asiu]

gt ‘attacked’ the umps ?

eddie would have got away with the
... ‘park your egos’ line

dimmy made a scene out of it


***

imagine what he could of achieved
if supported instead of white anted

he had a stick up his arse
about cultural change

the nose candy kid
deserves his share for selling out

and more
for selling gt out to his enemy

f*** butterrs

[BarryGrogan]

eddie would have got away with the
... ‘park your egos’ line

The AFL depends on Collingwood supporters. So it doesn't really matter what Eddie says or does.

The AFL will always fixture Collingwood and trat Collingwood in the best interests of the game. Of course for the AFL, 'the best interests of the game' refers to the bottom line. Bums on seats, eyes on screens.


Doesn't matter for s*** what GT said or didn't say - the AFL couldn't give a s*** as we only ever get 30k to games regardless.

Once a club starts getting 60k to games regularly, things start to fall their way. Funny that.

[shanegrambeau]

GT talks about the umpires putting their egos in their back pocket. Maybe he should have taken his own advice. He represented the SKFC not himself. Makes us all warm and fuzzy that he stuck it to City Hall but where did it get us? How did it help StKilda? For mine it shows how dumb GT was and what an egomaniac he was/is.

It's an interesting point.

What's to gain by fighting with the AFL? It feels good, but it's kind of like telling your boss to f*** off. In the long run, is it really going to help? Or hinder you?

As a supporter, would you rather a club that is 'sticking up for itself' whilst being rodgered at every turn for for being insolent?
Or a club that bends over and cops it - but isn't on the receiving end of the AFL's vindictiveness?

Good points by both of you IMO. GT was a clutz for sure, and I wonder if he took too much interest in putting a spanner in the works sometimes, but pushing back against City Hall is pretty handy. Ask Eddie McQuire. Altho Eddie loses it for other reasons, he's no slouch when it comes to being the everoily smile with an agenda when it comes to Collingwood. He gets in there and pushes plenty of buttons and sometimes I think he is very effective. Unfortunately, (or fortunately) GT doesn't have that political-friendly-speak like orange cordial in measured cups (despite his soft "gentle giant" voice modulation) . Whilst Eddie can be sharp like a drill in a velvet sock, Thommo comes on like a bulldozer painted in pink psychedelica camo.

[Teflon]

Interesting he drags McGuire's name into it. Perhaps we can hear from Parker, McGuire, Buttress, Blight. Forget Demetriou, too many skeletons in that man's closet, makes Thommo look like an amateur.

Question has to be asked, why bring this up now? What or whose purpose does this serve?

Exactly the question
Part 2 today and it’s all “I was footy Director but was last to know they (nasty Rod Butters and faceless men..) were going to sack Blighty (I love Blighty btw) and appoint me!!
Oh shock horror.....I was gobsmacked!!!

Honestly ANYONE who believes this career apologist and flog ought to have their head read. Never read a bigger load of revisionist BS in my life ....but again you ask: why now???
Old rent a headline Thomas.....always happy t drag and sir Saints dirty linen in public to make himself look good.
Guys a disgrace to the club - just **** off.

Have you listened to the podcast Teflon? Or are you just grabbing a headline here and there and adding your own dislike of Grant Thomas.

I highly recommend every died-in-the-wool Saint listens to this podcast. For one, you will learn more about the workings of the StKFC than you spent reading the machinations of posters on Saintsational.

As Molly would say, "do yourself a favour".

Why would I listen to a half assed attempt to revwrite history in his own image????
I KNOW all I need to know about good ole GT when I asked him point blank if he’d step aside as interim coach (what he was meant to be) only to be told by this buffoon that there was no one better qualified.....let’s be clear the guys AFL coaching credentials extended to Warrnambool FFS .

I get some on here fall over themselves when GT spin makes them feel like he’s “fighting for the Saints”.... all I see is a failed AFL has been who couldn’t get a job after he left us (other clubs know unlike many brainwashed on here). I see a bloke , doing it again this week in papers/podcasts, who for the sake of a headline to get some sort of relevance back in footy circles, who is prepared to drag our club and it’s pathetic history back through the ringer again to spin a story that has “I was just the victim in all this” written all over it.

Sorry I don’t buy the 80s corporate BS this snake oil salesman peddles.

[bigcarl]

Interesting he drags McGuire's name into it. Perhaps we can hear from Parker, McGuire, Buttress, Blight. Forget Demetriou, too many skeletons in that man's closet, makes Thommo look like an amateur.

Question has to be asked, why bring this up now? What or whose purpose does this serve?

Exactly the question
Part 2 today and it’s all “I was footy Director but was last to know they (nasty Rod Butters and faceless men..) were going to sack Blighty (I love Blighty btw) and appoint me!!
Oh shock horror.....I was gobsmacked!!!

Honestly ANYONE who believes this career apologist and flog ought to have their head read. Never read a bigger load of revisionist BS in my life ....but again you ask: why now???
Old rent a headline Thomas.....always happy t drag and sir Saints dirty linen in public to make himself look good.
Guys a disgrace to the club - just **** off.

Have you listened to the podcast Teflon? Or are you just grabbing a headline here and there and adding your own dislike of Grant Thomas.

I highly recommend every died-in-the-wool Saint listens to this podcast. For one, you will learn more about the workings of the StKFC than you spent reading the machinations of posters on Saintsational.

As Molly would say, "do yourself a favour".

Why would I listen to a half assed attempt to revwrite history in his own image????
I KNOW all I need to know about good ole GT when I asked him point blank if he’d step aside as interim coach (what he was meant to be) only to be told by this buffoon that there was no one better qualified.....let’s be clear the guys AFL coaching credentials extended to Warrnambool FFS .

I get some on here fall over themselves when GT spin makes them feel like he’s “fighting for the Saints”.... all I see is a failed AFL has been who couldn’t get a job after he left us (other clubs know unlike many brainwashed on here). I see a bloke , doing it again this week in papers/podcasts, who for the sake of a headline to get some sort of relevance back in footy circles, who is prepared to drag our club and it’s pathetic history back through the ringer again to spin a story that has “I was just the victim in all this” written all over it.

Sorry I don’t buy the 80s corporate BS this snake oil salesman peddles.

I sense that he is not your favourite, Teffers

[barneyboyz]

For all his knockers just think what we were and what we achieved under gt.
From woodenspooners to legitimate and exciting contenders. Sure we had some top picks but so have the deed, blues, and suns. Most of our group were lower rungs and trades. And before they’d got near their peak he took them to 2 prelims.
Lyon had the likes of roo, Goddard, Hayes, Joey, chips, Baker, Milney et al over their prime football ages. It was GT’s team. But where gt played youth Ross left the likes of Steven and Armo stewing in the seconds.
I’d give anything to have another gt right now. Surely we all would.

This

Well not entirely, some of our best were at the club prior to GT. Be interesting looking back had Ross got the job first? Armo took a long time to come good, and Jack Steven could have been a master stroke in 09. He was given license to run around and create havoc, and in such a well drilled team, no one could have stopped him.

We simply peaked early that year, and the pressure of our 'window closing' (was the theme at the time) after several failed attempts under GT got the better of us

Reckon somewhere in our clubs past, someone kicked a black cat under a ladder