#14!!!!!

[saintsRrising]

Geary has for several seasons been a potentially very good player whose overall ranking was demoted by the tendency to just blaze away with kicks that were not well directed.

From about the third point of the season he seems to have eliminated that tendency. As such his overall rating is now much higher.

In addition my observation this season is that he has improved an already very good defensive game into an elite defensive game.

The 2016 Geary is by far the best Geary we have seen.


If he can continue to play the offensive game you saw against the Dogs then you are then starting to enter AA territory for a small defender. But he needs to do that week in week out.

[stkfc1]

Just goes to show that even the older players can improve and you should never write anyone off. I give kudos to the coaching dept as obviously (like all of us) they've seen kicking disposal as a weakness in his game and together they've improved it. Player development is one of AR's strengths so we shouldn't be that surprised.

[BigMart]

Do you really reckon a 28yo who has played footy for nearly 20 years

Over ten years in a professional environment, training 4 days a week and playing professionally. Has actually improved his kicking in the last fortnight? And has only just started working on it??

I would think he is no better a kick now than what he was : months ago or three years ago... He's just had a few good kicking games and his perceived woeful kicking is a bit overblown??

He's not Darren Jarman or Clint Jones

Simply
He's just a pretty good AFL footballer... Which makes him a gun footballer at any other level

[skeptic]

Are you arguing that older players don't improve or get better at things?

[BigMart]

they can become better players
game sense experience - knowledge

they can learn new skills

but to improve or change a 15yo skill thrrough a few weeks practice... no

otherwise.... nick riewoldt would be a better kick at goal... and everyone would just get better at skills every year ... doesnt happen. some players are good kicks, some are not... and they practice the skill thousands of times per year..

[saintsRrising]

they can become better players
game sense experience - knowledge

they can learn new skills

but to improve or change a 15yo skill thrrough a few weeks practice... no

otherwise.... nick riewoldt would be a better kick at goal... and everyone would just get better at skills every year ... doesnt happen. some players are good kicks, some are not... and they practice the skill thousands of times per year..

Though Roo is a better kick at goal now. He went through several seasons where one would cringe wen he had a shot on goal. He even kicks banana shots successfully now whereas for most of his career he did not even attempt them.

I am also not sure if you have watched Steven play this year? By my observation he is using the ball much better and more damaging this season. Is it a trick of light or has his kicking improved? I think that it has improved.

BigMart there is not a one size fits all with how players improve. Some players do actually get better later. It is just silly to generalise that every player must be the same. Otherwise players like Loewe would not have improved his kicking on gal in accuracy and range. The reality is that most players do not continue to really improve, and also that most players therefore have very short careers. Some improve immediately, some slowly trend up, and others can be late bloomers like that ex-Dees mid whose name escapes me at present.

Peckett certainly became a better player later including in his ball use.

Blake became a better player later, and indeed while they are different players in where they play I seea lot of parrallels betwen Blake and Geary.

Maxie became an exceptional full back later.

Gehrig became a brute of a full forward later.

Even Milney learnt to be a better team player after GT struggled to get him to be that way.

With Geary's kicking it is not the skill side where I think he is better now, it is just that I believe that he is at last really thinking through where he kicks it better.

[skeptic]

they can become better players
game sense experience - knowledge

they can learn new skills

but to improve or change a 15yo skill thrrough a few weeks practice... no

otherwise.... nick riewoldt would be a better kick at goal... and everyone would just get better at skills every year ... doesnt happen. some players are good kicks, some are not... and they practice the skill thousands of times per year..

Though Roo is a better kick at goal now. He went through several seasons where one would cringe wen he had a shot on goal. He even kicks banana shots successfully now whereas for most of his career he did not even attempt them.

I am also not sure if you have watched Steven play this year? By my observation he is using the ball much better and more damaging this season. Is it a trick of light or has his kicking improved? I think that it has improved.

BigMart there is not a one size fits all with how players improve. Some players do actually get better later. It is just silly to generalise that every player must be the same. Otherwise players like Loewe would not have improved his kicking on gal in accuracy and range. The reality is that most players do not continue to really improve, and also that most players therefore have very short careers. Some improve immediately, some slowly trend up, and others can be late bloomers like that ex-Dees mid whose name escapes me at present.

Peckett certainly became a better player later including in his ball use.

Blake became a better player later, and indeed while they are different players in where they play I seea lot of parrallels betwen Blake and Geary.

Maxie became an exceptional full back later.

Gehrig became a brute of a full forward later.

Even Milney learnt to be a better team player after GT struggled to get him to be that way.

With Geary's kicking it is not the skill side where I think he is better now, it is just that I believe that he is at last really thinking through where he kicks it better.

Like

[BigMart]

SR

do you think most of those examples are covered under becoming better at the game through experience... learning to play FB or FF better or becoming a better team man...

did any of them become a better kick, mark, handballer after 25 or even 23... you practice your skills to maintain them... your confidence in you skill set can go up and or down... form
but to unlearn and relearn takes up to 150 hours and thats for a closed skill.. like a gold swing before it becomes autonomous

Peckett was always an exceptional kick... a designated kicker... an outside player...an extremely skilled player. just not that athletically gifted.

[saintsRrising]

SR

do you think most of those examples are covered under becoming better at the game through experience... learning to play FB or FF better or becoming a better team man...

did any of them become a better kick, mark, handballer after 25 or even 23... you practice your skills to maintain them... your confidence in you skill set can go up and or down... form
but to unlearn and relearn takes up to 150 hours and thats for a closed skill.. like a gold swing before it becomes autonomous

Peckett was always an exceptional kick... a designated kicker... an outside player...an extremely skilled player. just not that athletically gifted.

Steven is 25 years and 3 months. So the obvious answer is yes. Or ar you in denial too about his bcoming much better in his disposal this year? (Prior to this season Steven would burst away, but often shank it. This year he hurts the opposition by foot and often at crucail parts of the game. He is now well and truly a matchwinner).

Roos is how old? So again the answer is an obvious yes.

Peckett in the last part of his career became an intelligent ball user. Because of this he became a wingman. He becamje very good at knowing when to find space at exactly te right time.

This year despite what you say Geary has improved. You can deny it all you want, but that is the reality. An old dog can learn new tricks.

[stonecold]

Does the President know Geary?????

And it's not the 6 month Mark Yet, Go your hardest Donnie T Wanna Be!!!!!

[BigMart]

Geary is no better than he was last year

Just three weeks ago most numpties on here wanted him out... The point of this thread

Is Jack Steven really a better kick... Or more consistent kick? Was he capable of good kicking last year?? Does he compose himself better with the footy now???
A better kick or just takes a balance step now... Because to me, his kicking action is no different... He has an inside out wobble before a fairly high drop and he hits the ball hard.

Geary is a better kick if he doesn't think... He panics under pressure which causes him to 'nurse' the ball and often doesn't strike the ball well.

[saintsRrising]

Just three weeks ago most numpties on here wanted him out...

If you mean by numpties everyone bar you, then this is clearly wrong, as most forumites did not want him out of the team 3 weeks ago.

The point of this thread

The way I read it the point of this thread was basically that Geary was now playing in such a way that if you now wanted him out of our best 22 that you knew nothing about football. I would agree with this.

[BigMart]

No

SR wrong again

By numpties... I mean those who wanted him out... The same d***heads that are trying to suggest all of a sudden, mid 2016 at 28years of age he's become a decent player... After being useless at 27.5

Funny, his B&F finish and the fact he's been in the leadership group for years suggest he's always been ok... Oh and 3 afl coaches thought he went ok

[Con Gorozidis]

No

SR wrong again

By numpties... I mean those who wanted him out... The same d***heads that are trying to suggest all of a sudden, mid 2016 at 28years of age he's become a decent player... After being useless at 27.5

Funny, his B&F finish and the fact he's been in the leadership group for years suggest he's always been ok... Oh and 3 afl coaches thought he went ok

The facts are that at 28 his Disposal Efficiency is career best. This is a fact. His Rebound 50 work is also career best.

So he is playing better than ever this year. He was certainly never a slouch but he was never this good either.

[saintsRrising]

No

SR wrong again

By numpties... I mean those who wanted him out... The same d***heads that are trying to suggest all of a sudden, mid 2016 at 28years of age he's become a decent player... After being useless at 27.5

Funny, his B&F finish and the fact he's been in the leadership group for years suggest he's always been ok... Oh and 3 afl coaches thought he went ok

I am not sure why you are raising his b&f finishes etc with respect to my posts as I never wanted him out except the plainly obvious one that you are clearly wrong and so in your notmal style raise itrelevant points rather than discuss what was raised.

. Like many his disposal at times made me downmark him but his many pluses more than outweighed that deficieny.

But the point is that most including the numpties all agree that he is better this year. You are the lone voice that he is not. This is an opinion site and so that is ok.


My opinion is that he has improved. My opinion also different thay yours is that some older players can and do improve. You have stated that they do not. My interpretation of facts would support both. Your opinion is different.

You are avoiding discussing the points raised and are bringing in red herrings once again . I look forward to you instead backing up your point that mature play never ever improve.

[skeptic]

No

SR wrong again

By numpties... I mean those who wanted him out... The same d***heads that are trying to suggest all of a sudden, mid 2016 at 28years of age he's become a decent player... After being useless at 27.5

Funny, his B&F finish and the fact he's been in the leadership group for years suggest he's always been ok... Oh and 3 afl coaches thought he went ok

The facts are that at 28 his Disposal Efficiency is career best. This is a fact. His Rebound 50 work is also career best.

So he is playing better than ever this year. He was certainly never a slouch but he was never this good either.

U could really pick BM's argument apart sentence by sentence but it's getting hard to see the point... It seems to me to be more about being right rather than discussing the point.

The fact that ppl wanted him dropped or felt there were aspects of his game could be better doesn't mean that they never rated him or felt that he has only ever been good in the last 0.5 of his age.

This is a classic BM argument strategy of countering a false point that he puts out there.

Some says that we need a 2nd ruck in the team to give Hickey a rest... A typical BM style response: you can't have 2 rucks in the team unless they're good and the idea of our trading our first round pick for Goldstein is stupid. He's too old now and we need young mids in the team.
From then on he'd refer to the initial poster as the guy that wants to trade away youth for dinosaur rucks.

It's getting really boring

[Enrico_Misso]

Another solid game from the little champ today.
Really noticed how much ground he covers and how selfless and courageous he is.

He should definitely be our next captain.

[stkfc1]

His disposal has improved out of sight. Some fantastic passes by him today. Becoming a real weapon. Bloody fantastic stuff. Well done.

[saintsRrising]

The 2016 Geary is by far the best Geary we have seen.

.

In a season of big improvers (Hickey, Membrey, Ross and Acres) Geary showed that it is not just the young players who can improve.

Geary is no longer a "but" player. Throughout his career he has been praised for many facets of his game (leadership, clubman, toughness, workrate, huge engine, defensive abilities etc) ...great defender," but" poor disposal was a fairly common summation.

In 2016 not only did he remove that "but",but he became a better defender and in the last half of the season became more offensive in his play as well.

Great year and a well deserved B&F placing. And remember too that B&F voting (by the coaches) is not just a measure of who has played really well, but also very much who has achieved best what the coaches have asked for.

[saintspremiers]

SR, given we have embraced Pride & diversity there is nothing wrong with Gears being a "but" player.

[WellardSaint]

No

SR wrong again

By numpties... I mean those who wanted him out... The same d***heads that are trying to suggest all of a sudden, mid 2016 at 28years of age he's become a decent player... After being useless at 27.5

Funny, his B&F finish and the fact he's been in the leadership group for years suggest he's always been ok... Oh and 3 afl coaches thought he went ok

One really great aspect of this forum- we can all get on here and voice our opinions. It's called "discussion".
I agree with BigMart more often than not, but this theory/idea is one about which I have to disagree.
And it's good that he doesn't argue in the manner of one of the least-liked posters, who has gone over to bigfooty; that person was hateful and vile.
BM can mount a reasoned and logical discussion.

[felix]

What is it you dusagree with BM about on this occassion. Are you saying Gears is no good.?