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B.M wrote: ↑Sun 15 Jan 2023 9:56am
What has team success got to do with individual greatness?
Bob Stilton
Robert Flower
Matthew Richardson
All in poor team era
All club and AFL champions
I could name plenty of multiple premiership players who were no more than GOPs
Those 3 players won league wide accolades, not just for their club.
Any chance you could answer the following question without weasel words or skirting around?
Is winning a B&F for a 20-2 premiership team the same level of achievement (difficulty, honour, etc) as winning one for a 2-20 wooden spoon team?
Great question Dud
You won’t get an answer…it’s too hard for BM to admit he’s kinda missed the entire point…
Guys, and with respect Teflon, this is the kind of post that only serves to continue creating combativeness and abuse on the forum. It's low level, but it's third person belittling. There's no other purpose for a post like this. There's no furtherance of any discussion or any footy related information. It's purely a shot at another poster that is intended to belittle. It's point scoring. Strictly by the rules, it's suspension worthy. There's WAY too much of this going on on the forum for my liking. Please consider what you - and this applies to everyone - are posting before you hit the submit button.
Josh Gibson won 2 B&Fs in premiership seasons - was he better than Sam Mitchell or Luke Hodge who won B&Fs in other seasons?
Yes a premiership B&F is significant- much better than a B&F in a wooden spoon season - BUT DOESNT DIMINISH THE B&F In the wooden spoon season!! You’ve still got to play well - against the same opponents
Robert Flower was a great player at Melbourne in a poor era
Put him in a better team - he might have been better!
The argument that good players in poor teams aren’t actually that good - is ridiculous
Otherwise the AA side may as well just be the premiership side?
The old state of origin side just made up of top teams - no Barker or any other Saints of that era
He was that triple Brownlow Medalist that Eric Guy nearly killed one day at the junction oval. Split him down the middle with the best shirtfront I had ever seen.
Disrespectful to cal him "that stinky little fella" but.
Last edited by saynta on Mon 16 Jan 2023 3:09pm, edited 1 time in total.
He was that triple Brownlow Medalist that Eric Guy nearly killed one day at the junction oval. Spit him down the middle with the best shirtfront I had ever seen.
Disrespectful to cal him "that stinky little fella" but.
I think DB was having a little joke - stinky in relation to stilton cheese as Skilton was incorrectly spelt.
Whilst I’m doing a ‘Spelly’. Do you mean Skilton was split down the middle? I don’t think our strong man Eric Guy would resort to spiting do you? I can remember Yabby, stating that Guy was as tough as ‘boarding house steak’. That’s another thing of the past, the old boarding houses. Gee there used to be a lot of them around the Junction Oval in days of yore.
He was that triple Brownlow Medalist that Eric Guy nearly killed one day at the junction oval. Split him down the middle with the best shirtfront I had ever seen.
Disrespectful to cal him "that stinky little fella" but.
I think DB was having a little joke - stinky in relation to stilton cheese as Skilton was incorrectly spelt.
Whilst I’m doing a ‘Spelly’. Do you mean Skilton was split down the middle? I don’t think our strong man Eric Guy would resort to spiting do you? I can remember Yabby, stating that Guy was as tough as ‘boarding house steak’. That’s another thing of the past, the old boarding houses. Gee there used to be a lot of them around the Junction Oval in days of yore.
B.M wrote: ↑Mon 16 Jan 2023 11:03am
Any B&F at AFL level is an achievement
Seb won it in a 12-10 season
Andrew Thompson won it in a 2-20 season
Josh Gibson won 2 B&Fs in premiership seasons - was he better than Sam Mitchell or Luke Hodge who won B&Fs in other seasons?
Yes a premiership B&F is significant- much better than a B&F in a wooden spoon season - BUT DOESNT DIMINISH THE B&F In the wooden spoon season!! You’ve still got to play well - against the same opponents
Robert Flower was a great player at Melbourne in a poor era
Put him in a better team - he might have been better!
The argument that good players in poor teams aren’t actually that good - is ridiculous
Otherwise the AA side may as well just be the premiership side?
The old state of origin side just made up of top teams - no Barker or any other Saints of that era
Thank you.
So you agree - all B&Fs aren't equal.
Of course you have to be a good player (have a good year) to win one. But it's a very subjective award that is a poor measuring stick of the quality of a player across the broader AFL.
Winning a B&F does not equal being an elite / A grade player.
Not winning a B&F does not equal being a sub elite / A grade player.
There are/will be players in the AFL HOF who never won a club B&F.
Jack Steven has as many B&Fs as Tony Lockett, Gary Ablett Snr, Matthew Lloyd and Lance Franklin combined!
Need we go on?
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
B.M wrote: ↑Mon 16 Jan 2023 11:03am
Any B&F at AFL level is an achievement
Seb won it in a 12-10 season
Andrew Thompson won it in a 2-20 season
Josh Gibson won 2 B&Fs in premiership seasons - was he better than Sam Mitchell or Luke Hodge who won B&Fs in other seasons?
Yes a premiership B&F is significant- much better than a B&F in a wooden spoon season - BUT DOESNT DIMINISH THE B&F In the wooden spoon season!! You’ve still got to play well - against the same opponents
Robert Flower was a great player at Melbourne in a poor era
Put him in a better team - he might have been better!
The argument that good players in poor teams aren’t actually that good - is ridiculous
Otherwise the AA side may as well just be the premiership side?
The old state of origin side just made up of top teams - no Barker or any other Saints of that era
Thank you.
So you agree - all B&Fs aren't equal.
Of course you have to be a good player (have a good year) to win one. But it's a very subjective award that is a poor measuring stick of the quality of a player across the broader AFL.
Winning a B&F does not equal being an elite / A grade player.
Not winning a B&F does not equal being a sub elite / A grade player.
There are/will be players in the AFL HOF who never won a club B&F.
Jack Steven has as many B&Fs as Tony Lockett, Gary Ablett Snr, Matthew Lloyd and Lance Franklin combined!
He was that triple Brownlow Medalist that Eric Guy nearly killed one day at the junction oval. Spit him down the middle with the best shirtfront I had ever seen.
Disrespectful to cal him "that stinky little fella" but.
I think DB was having a little joke - stinky in relation to stilton cheese as Skilton was incorrectly spelt.
Whilst I’m doing a ‘Spelly’. Do you mean Skilton was split down the middle? I don’t think our strong man Eric Guy would resort to spiting do you? I can remember Yabby, stating that Guy was as tough as ‘boarding house steak’. That’s another thing of the past, the old boarding houses. Gee there used to be a lot of them around the Junction Oval in days of yore.
Thank you loris for picking up on my Krafty but poor attempt at caseiculture humor.
There's only one rule in the jungle! When the LYON's hungry, he eats!
He was that triple Brownlow Medalist that Eric Guy nearly killed one day at the junction oval. Spit him down the middle with the best shirtfront I had ever seen.
Disrespectful to cal him "that stinky little fella" but.
I think DB was having a little joke - stinky in relation to stilton cheese as Skilton was incorrectly spelt.
Whilst I’m doing a ‘Spelly’. Do you mean Skilton was split down the middle? I don’t think our strong man Eric Guy would resort to spiting do you? I can remember Yabby, stating that Guy was as tough as ‘boarding house steak’. That’s another thing of the past, the old boarding houses. Gee there used to be a lot of them around the Junction Oval in days of yore.
Thank you loris for picking up on my Krafty but poor attempt at caseiculture humor.
He was that triple Brownlow Medalist that Eric Guy nearly killed one day at the junction oval. Spit him down the middle with the best shirtfront I had ever seen.
Disrespectful to cal him "that stinky little fella" but.
I think DB was having a little joke - stinky in relation to stilton cheese as Skilton was incorrectly spelt.
Whilst I’m doing a ‘Spelly’. Do you mean Skilton was split down the middle? I don’t think our strong man Eric Guy would resort to spiting do you? I can remember Yabby, stating that Guy was as tough as ‘boarding house steak’. That’s another thing of the past, the old boarding houses. Gee there used to be a lot of them around the Junction Oval in days of yore.
Thank you loris for picking up on my Krafty but poor attempt at caseiculture humor.
B.M wrote: ↑Tue 17 Jan 2023 12:27am
They are not AFL greats
But they are StK greats as they were/are consistent high level performers
And supporters wonder how it's possible we're the least successful club in VFL/AFL history.
Spot on Dud.
Nobody in AFL idolises the individual over team success better than Saints…
It’s what you get with 1 flag in 150 years…
If some supporters had their way the club would never delist a player to actually improve….they’d be quite happy to sit around pretending player ‘x’ is a super star …when the rest of the comp knows it’s nonsense
Mediocrity.
you’re welcome 
