Run Sainters, run....

[saintsRrising]

As I have mentioned in a couple of posts, but will expand upon here, I think part of RL's problem this year (with part of his gameplan)...is that our runners have not been good this year.


Pace and run with dash off your HB line breaks lines and sets up attacks.

Good running can get through zoing and combats floods.

Good running is knowing when to find space....and to create options for team mates by running in support. When you are down on confidence you run to the wrong spots..or just do not run enough often enough. Workrate creates opportunity.

Now you do not have to have extreme pace to bea good runner...but palyers with good pace can create opportunities that are denied to slower players.

*Gram has been poor ...Interesting that his 3 best games ranking wise were all losses.

*Fiora has been well below last years form and has been dropped..
*X has been patchy
*Joey has been quiet and below last years form
* sam Gilbert before his injury did not quite have the dash he displayed last year.
*and Dal has also not been able to find as many holes consiteantly. His 3 best games have all been wins.

* Schneider has been good...but has missed games


* Add to this that Sam Fisher is an excellent running half back...but has had to often play more a key position role. This by the way is probably the main reason that Ros brought an underdone Goose back as his reasoning would not doubt have been that a "freed" attacking Sam more than makes up for an underdone Goose making a few errors in a key defensive postion.
Interestingly when you look at Sam's Dream Team or Supercoach ratings....all of his better games have been when we won:

Game Date DreamTeam SuperCoach
Round 7 *Win * 76 * 91
Round 6 *Loss * 45 * 63
Round 5 *Win * 100 * 110
Round 4 *Loss * 73 * 67
Round 3 *Loss * 70 * 79
Round 2 *Win * 78 * 118
Round 1 *Win * 92 * 127


* Which mainly leaves the old Master Banger as the player who has still been able to find space and run. Unfortunately for Saints fans....his TOG is being limited this year. ..but again Harvey's best games have been wins.

The Saints need more run in the team, even better if it is with pace. But good running is not just about pace...and you don't have to have pace to be a good runner.

This is why:
* The Saints went after Schnieder...
* Ross keeps perservering with Raph


Recruiting wise you can imagine Ross saying that he wanted another very quick player that could run the lines...and perhaps this is why Howard went up early onon our shopping list. However to date his improvement has been less that desired.

But back to now....

The Saints desperately need Gram to find form...and it is not just the lack of run..but his disposal is very poor this year. Gram will be testing Ross's patience and he may well find himself dropped to Casey to find confidence and form in place of say Geary who showed in the NAB some dash in the backline.

RL would desperately want Sam back as a running back, but Goose has gone down and Max is out for a week or two.

Fiora has had a poor year...but Ross needs pace and run. Will he eyeball Aaron and give him another run?

Raph can be a valuable runner...but needs to eliminate his brain fades.


But it is not just pace that Ross needs...it is a greater workrate from our players. Working harder creates options....and this is a key part of why Harvey is such a great player. He constantly runs and presents, runs and supports...

Our players need to run more....run Sainters, run...

[saint66au]

Think its been proven time and again this year that given a choice between

A. taking the ball, running, bouncing, breaking a line gaining 30-40m but kicking to a contest

and..

B. Stopping, treading water, weighing up the options then finding a player on his own even if they are behind or across the ground

....the team are told to choose option B every time

[rodgerfox]

Think its been proven time and again this year that given a choice between

A. taking the ball, running, bouncing, breaking a line gaining 30-40m but kicking to a contest

and..

B. Stopping, treading water, weighing up the options then finding a player on his own even if they are behind or across the ground

....the team are told to choose option B every time

Whether they are told to or not, I don't know. But you're right, we certainly do take option B every time.

If taking Option A is considered unaccountable or an 'all out attacking' style, then so be it - that's the option I'd prefer every time.

We have the cattle to do it.

[longtimesaint]

With Maguire now out for the season is it worth promoting McQualter and giving him another try?
His form with Casey this season has been good and he will know it's his last chance.
He can provide more run and rotation in the midfield and is also a goal kicking midfielder.

[starsign]

agree we need more run and runners, and its the team thing thats important ie they have to run together in support more often
I notice its almost instinctive, or like training drill when you watch the best of the rest doing it ...the Cats eg seem to know theres going to be support behind and to either side, its almost s if they hve eyes in the bck of their heads....of course talking helps , but again a team thing which we re well down on some of these spects as well

just one on Grammy ...I thought his kicking was marginally better last week , at least he seemed to be executing targeted drop punts instead of those mungrel go-anywhere roosts more often...there were definite signs i recon!

[barneyboyz]

As I have mentioned in a couple of posts, but will expand upon here, I think part of RL's problem this year (with part of his gameplan)...is that our runners have not been good this year.


Pace and run with dash off your HB line breaks lines and sets up attacks.

Good running can get through zoing and combats floods.

Good running is knowing when to find space....and to create options for team mates by running in support. When you are down on confidence you run to the wrong spots..or just do not run enough often enough. Workrate creates opportunity.

Now you do not have to have extreme pace to bea good runner...but palyers with good pace can create opportunities that are denied to slower players.

*Gram has been poor ...Interesting that his 3 best games ranking wise were all losses.

*Fiora has been well below last years form and has been dropped..
*X has been patchy
*Joey has been quiet and below last years form
* sam Gilbert before his injury did not quite have the dash he displayed last year.
*and Dal has also not been able to find as many holes consiteantly. His 3 best games have all been wins.

* Schneider has been good...but has missed games


* Add to this that Sam Fisher is an excellent running half back...but has had to often play more a key position role. This by the way is probably the main reason that Ros brought an underdone Goose back as his reasoning would not doubt have been that a "freed" attacking Sam more than makes up for an underdone Goose making a few errors in a key defensive postion.
Interestingly when you look at Sam's Dream Team or Supercoach ratings....all of his better games have been when we won:

Game Date DreamTeam SuperCoach
Round 7 *Win * 76 * 91
Round 6 *Loss * 45 * 63
Round 5 *Win * 100 * 110
Round 4 *Loss * 73 * 67
Round 3 *Loss * 70 * 79
Round 2 *Win * 78 * 118
Round 1 *Win * 92 * 127


* Which mainly leaves the old Master Banger as the player who has still been able to find space and run. Unfortunately for Saints fans....his TOG is being limited this year. ..but again Harvey's best games have been wins.

The Saints need more run in the team, even better if it is with pace. But good running is not just about pace...and you don't have to have pace to be a good runner.

This is why:
* The Saints went after Schnieder...
* Ross keeps perservering with Raph


Recruiting wise you can imagine Ross saying that he wanted another very quick player that could run the lines...and perhaps this is why Howard went up early onon our shopping list. However to date his improvement has been less that desired.

But back to now....

The Saints desperately need Gram to find form...and it is not just the lack of run..but his disposal is very poor this year. Gram will be testing Ross's patience and he may well find himself dropped to Casey to find confidence and form in place of say Geary who showed in the NAB some dash in the backline.

RL would desperately want Sam back as a running back, but Goose has gone down and Max is out for a week or two.

Fiora has had a poor year...but Ross needs pace and run. Will he eyeball Aaron and give him another run?

Raph can be a valuable runner...but needs to eliminate his brain fades.


But it is not just pace that Ross needs...it is a greater workrate from our players. Working harder creates options....and this is a key part of why Harvey is such a great player. He constantly runs and presents, runs and supports...

Our players need to run more....run Sainters, run...

Running toward the ball carrier is lacking; there is too many stagnent plays through the corridor, players are looking up at half back and no one is running at them making play, all they see is potential contests right through the middle.

St kilda has done this at times for years, now is no different than before.

I teach 12 year olds about this, if there isn't people coming to meet the ball, then all there is is contests; I feel that Ross knows what is happening and will gradually modify the "plan" to create the run, just watch our second half of the season, it will morph into better footy and I expect some of the top teams atm. may stumble somewhat

[barneyboyz]

As I have mentioned in a couple of posts, but will expand upon here, I think part of RL's problem this year (with part of his gameplan)...is that our runners have not been good this year.


Pace and run with dash off your HB line breaks lines and sets up attacks.

Good running can get through zoing and combats floods.

Good running is knowing when to find space....and to create options for team mates by running in support. When you are down on confidence you run to the wrong spots..or just do not run enough often enough. Workrate creates opportunity.

Now you do not have to have extreme pace to bea good runner...but palyers with good pace can create opportunities that are denied to slower players.

*Gram has been poor ...Interesting that his 3 best games ranking wise were all losses.

*Fiora has been well below last years form and has been dropped..
*X has been patchy
*Joey has been quiet and below last years form
* sam Gilbert before his injury did not quite have the dash he displayed last year.
*and Dal has also not been able to find as many holes consiteantly. His 3 best games have all been wins.

* Schneider has been good...but has missed games


* Add to this that Sam Fisher is an excellent running half back...but has had to often play more a key position role. This by the way is probably the main reason that Ros brought an underdone Goose back as his reasoning would not doubt have been that a "freed" attacking Sam more than makes up for an underdone Goose making a few errors in a key defensive postion.
Interestingly when you look at Sam's Dream Team or Supercoach ratings....all of his better games have been when we won:

Game Date DreamTeam SuperCoach
Round 7 *Win * 76 * 91
Round 6 *Loss * 45 * 63
Round 5 *Win * 100 * 110
Round 4 *Loss * 73 * 67
Round 3 *Loss * 70 * 79
Round 2 *Win * 78 * 118
Round 1 *Win * 92 * 127


* Which mainly leaves the old Master Banger as the player who has still been able to find space and run. Unfortunately for Saints fans....his TOG is being limited this year. ..but again Harvey's best games have been wins.

The Saints need more run in the team, even better if it is with pace. But good running is not just about pace...and you don't have to have pace to be a good runner.

This is why:
* The Saints went after Schnieder...
* Ross keeps perservering with Raph


Recruiting wise you can imagine Ross saying that he wanted another very quick player that could run the lines...and perhaps this is why Howard went up early onon our shopping list. However to date his improvement has been less that desired.

But back to now....

The Saints desperately need Gram to find form...and it is not just the lack of run..but his disposal is very poor this year. Gram will be testing Ross's patience and he may well find himself dropped to Casey to find confidence and form in place of say Geary who showed in the NAB some dash in the backline.

RL would desperately want Sam back as a running back, but Goose has gone down and Max is out for a week or two.

Fiora has had a poor year...but Ross needs pace and run. Will he eyeball Aaron and give him another run?

Raph can be a valuable runner...but needs to eliminate his brain fades.


But it is not just pace that Ross needs...it is a greater workrate from our players. Working harder creates options....and this is a key part of why Harvey is such a great player. He constantly runs and presents, runs and supports...

Our players need to run more....run Sainters, run...

Running toward the ball carrier is lacking; there is too many stagnent plays through the corridor, players are looking up at half back and no one is running at them making play, all they see is potential contests right through the middle.

St kilda has done this at times for years, now is no different than before.

I teach 12 year olds about this, if there isn't people coming to meet the ball, then all there is is contests; I feel that Ross knows what is happening and will gradually modify the "plan" to create the run, just watch our second half of the season, it will morph into better footy and I expect some of the top teams atm. may stumble somewhat

Might I add also that St kildas midfield situation hasn't been any different for years either, they have had to rove from opposition ruckmen for years now, watch them adjust too

[Teflon]

Good thread SR.

This was very evident against Tigers - particularly watching Foley etc for them run through the corridor and link up when we just stopped, went sideways and looked indecisive before kicking to a well flooded fwd set up.

One concern I have about players like Gram....their poor disposal can really hurt you on the rebound so its great to run etc but for gods sake hit the target cause sides just cut you up the other way whilst we are out position.

[Saints Premiers 2008]

when gram burst onto the scene in 2006 a few of us myself included were shot down for mentioned his poor disposal...

we were told to give him time...well???

just because he can run...big whoop...he has to get rid of the footy somehow and kicking it seems to cause more trouble than its worth...

so what do we do with him???

[saintsRrising]

when gram burst onto the scene in 2006 a few of us myself included were shot down for mentioned his poor disposal...

we were told to give him time...well???

just because he can run...big whoop...he has to get rid of the footy somehow and kicking it seems to cause more trouble than its worth...

so what do we do with him???

His disposal actually became quite good...but last year declined...and this year apart from the NAB GF sems to have declined further again.

We need him to rediscover his footskills.

[St DAC]

I'm not convinced Gram was ever a better than average kick ... we haven't adequately replaced the combination of run and precision delivery of Aussie Jones, and it shows.

I'd love a Gilbee type kicker running from half-back in our team ... Goddard has the kicking ability, but not the running ability.

[iwantmeseats]

Think its been proven time and again this year that given a choice between

A. taking the ball, running, bouncing, breaking a line gaining 30-40m but kicking to a contest

and..

B. Stopping, treading water, weighing up the options then finding a player on his own even if they are behind or across the ground

....the team are told to choose option B every time

frickin god damn exactly right!!!!! You just cant get it to work like this, foootballers must be largely allowed to play on instinct. Unfortunately it all comes back to that word again, gameplan

[Teflon]

Think its been proven time and again this year that given a choice between

A. taking the ball, running, bouncing, breaking a line gaining 30-40m but kicking to a contest

and..

B. Stopping, treading water, weighing up the options then finding a player on his own even if they are behind or across the ground

....the team are told to choose option B every time

frickin god damn exactly right!!!!! You just cant get it to work like this, foootballers must be largely allowed to play on instinct. Unfortunately it all comes back to that word again, gameplan

Rubbish.

Geelong just dont run round on "instinct" they play to a game pland AND as a TEAM. We dont. We dont have that discipline as a team yet sadly.

[The OtherThommo]

By all means, let players play on instinct. Like Gram. His instinct is to freakin' panic whenever he gets the ball. Watch him - when he gets clear now his head goes up, he holds the ball high and he swings his kicking leg across his body like an ice hockey sweeper.

It is calm footballers who use the ball best, not fools whose one trick has been worked out. Lyon played him up the ground 3 weeks in a row - he still got sucked back and went into a flat panic every time he had the pill.

Maybe Brisbane knew something. Grammie is just one of a bunch who played better football 2 years before their so called peak.

[saintsRrising]

I think with Gram it is partly that he is out of form ...and partly that opposition coaches have analysed his game and worked him out.
They deny him space and exploit his poor defensive skills with match ups.

[rogerwa]

with all the wank about modern day footy reminds me of the doc's 1/2 time address against fitz in our last game at moorabbin

the doc's address....ya gotta RUN fellows & RUN & RUN & RUN...what will you feel like walking off the ground losing today

3/4 time address...dont just stand there ya gotta MOVE,CREATE,PRESENT & keep on CREATING

nothings changed....if they cant do it pyss em off & replace em with those that not only can but WILL

[saintsRrising]

Well two months on...and the Saints are running more..and have lifted their workrate. Suddenly our gameplan "looks" better and more fluid and the goals have been flowing.

Gram is back in form
CJ has blossomed
Eddy has come in
Joey has found form
Blake's great form has freed up Sam Fisher
Demspter has found touch
Roo is now 100% fit and is running (leaping and kicking) better
Even Fiora this week managed a serviceable game and added to our run .

...and yes Banger is still Banger!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Lenny Hayes was interviewed on the radio last week pre-Hawks game and in talking about the Saints better form he mentioned how working harder created space...and options.

Credit to Ross too for the Hawks game where he brought in two runners in Fiora and Schneider for Allen and Gwilt (whereas like many I was for bring in Gardi, if fit, plus one runner).

[SainterX]

And it has only taken Ross 37 and a half rounds to see that the simple attacking gameplan works with the players we have LOL

Better late then never however