Sam Gilbert in 2019. Still important?

[SemperFidelis]

Gilbert is a star. That I have no doubt.

Those who hate him forget he's missed heaps of footy over several years and it takes months to get back into full form.

Great game tonight. Awesome actually.

This

[SainterK]

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=86703&p=1488616&hil ... d#p1488616

this discussion, same time last year...

[8856brother]

Had his pants pulled down tonight.

[skeptic]

I don't think anyone forgets that he's missed heaps of football... Isn't that kind of the point? At what stage do we stop blaming injuries for the fact that he hasn't had a good season in 4-5 years.

Like I said earlier... He's match fit now, he's worked his way into the team n held his spot, he's played a really good game and demonstrated what he is capable of. Good players back up.

To spell it out, the argument is not about what he is capable of... It's about what he is and what he should be producing. Week in week out

[HitTheBoundary]

Had his pants pulled down tonight.

One of the funniest things I've seen in a while. He kept going for the ball with the full moon shining.
Hope it makes youtube.

Lucky Hopoate doesn't play for the cats.

[Con Gorozidis]

DE = 52%.

As I say week in week out. Gilbo is in our best 22. I am not bagging him. But he is miles away from being a top grade AFL player. Mainly because of his disposal AND decision making. He is not in the AFL top 100 or probably even 200. He is not even in the Saints top 10.
B* F votes back me up on this.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is :

1. deluded or living in 2009; and
2. cannot back it up with independent data e.g B & F votes.

[SainterK]

DE = 52%.

As I say week in week out. Gilbo is in our best 22. I am not bagging him. But he is miles away from being a top grade AFL player. Mainly because of his disposal AND decision making. He is not in the AFL top 100 or probably even 200. He is not even in the Saints top 10.
B* F votes back me up on this.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is :

1. deluded or living in 2009; and
2. cannot back it up with independent data e.g B & F votes.

I still think we should see if we get any nibbles, his form is terrific...his value has lifted...IMHO a side may see him as a Higgins to North type scenario and we could get overs.

I just think his body is honestly shot and we'd be nuts not to entertain a decent offer.

Nothing against him, I like him, always said he was a midfielder.

[Sobraz]

Gilbert is a gun. Fit, up & running top 5 player at the club.

Con is drunk.

[SaintPav]

To spell it out, the argument is not about what he is capable of... It's about what he is and what he should be producing. Week in week out

No different to any other player.

Gilbert has played some good footy and holds his place in the team, easily.

We missed the opportunity to trade him years ago.

[Con Gorozidis]

Gilbert is a gun. Fit, up & running top 5 player at the club.

Con is drunk.

He is not a gun. How can a gun never make a club 10 B & F when the club is in the bottom half of the ladder? Please provide me with a logical answer.
Here is what Inside Footy think:

http://www.aflplayerratings.com.au/Rati ... am-GILBERT

Tell me why you think your opinion is worth more than:

a) Inside Footy
b) Club B & F

[Con Gorozidis]

To spell it out, the argument is not about what he is capable of... It's about what he is and what he should be producing. Week in week out

No different to any other player.

Gilbert has played some good footy and holds his place in the team, easily.

We missed the opportunity to trade him years ago.

Do I think he is in our best 22? YES!!!!

Do I think he is in the AFL top 100? NO!!!

And every single independent assessment tells me I am correct.

If you are not in the AFL top 100, then you are NOT a 'gun.'

[Armoooo]

I have been a detractor in recent years but he was great tonight IMO.

The issue for him is however that he is playing a position which he seem to have a lot of good options. If we could get a top 30 pick for him I would very much consider it. I don't think we would so going forward I think we play him when his form supports it.

[Con Gorozidis]

Gilbert is a star. That I have no doubt.

Those who hate him forget he's missed heaps of footy over several years and it takes months to get back into full form.

Great game tonight. Awesome actually.

This

Are you serious? His DE was 50%. He has NOT had a top 10 finish in the Saints B & F since 2010.
Here is what INside Footy think:

http://www.aflplayerratings.com.au/Rati ... am-GILBERT


You cant just pretend kicking and decision making are not part of the game. Gilbo is tall, fast, great tackler, good in the air and has a great side-step.
Does this make him a gun??? NO!!!! Because he keeps turning it over. We arent in the 80s. Decision making and kicking COUNT. You must give them WEIGHT.

[SaintPav]

To spell it out, the argument is not about what he is capable of... It's about what he is and what he should be producing. Week in week out

No different to any other player.

Gilbert has played some good footy and holds his place in the team, easily.

We missed the opportunity to trade him years ago.

Do I think he is in our best 22? YES!!!!

Do I think he is in the AFL top 100? NO!!!

And every single independent assessment tells me I am correct.

If you are not in the AFL top 100, then you are NOT a 'gun.'

He's not a gun but he's a champ, champ.

[Con Gorozidis]

Ok hes a gun and a champion. Only nobody knows about it but a few people on Saintsational. Shhhhh!!!!! Lets keep it a secret !!!! Very objective and non-partisan of course. Not even the club knows about it if we go by B & F votes. Just a select elite group of secret special know it alls on here. Seems legit. No blinkers on or anything. Shhhhh! We don't want anyone else finding about this secret 'gunness.' All the stats are wrong. All the reviews are wrong. All the journos are WRONG. All the umps are wrong. All the people who vote for the club b & f are WRONG!!!!!! Only we know this hidden secret talent. Shhhhhh!!!

[SaintPav]

Ok hes a gun and a champion. Only nobody knows about it but a few people on Saintsational. Shhhhh!!!!! Lets keep it a secret !!!! Very objective and non-partisan of course. Not even the club knows about it if we go by B & F votes. Just a select elite group of secret special know it alls on here. Seems legit. No blinkers on or anything. Shhhhh! We don't want anyone else finding about this secret 'gunness.' All the stats are wrong. All the reviews are wrong. All the journos are WRONG. All the umps are wrong. All the people who vote for club b & f are WRONG!!!!!! Only we know this hidden secret talent. Shhhhhh!!!

He's probably more of a legend than a gun or a champ. Everyone knows that.

[Con Gorozidis]

Gilbert has been injured the last 3 years and as such has no hope of finishing in the top 10 in the B&F for the last 3 years.
.

Stop making up lame excuses. Gilbert played 21 games in 2012 and DID NOT EVEN make the top 10.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/pc-s ... am-gilbert

http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/spo ... d-fairest/

2011 he played 21 games and I dont know where he finished but it wasnt top 3.

http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-pre ... 6162101779

Its kind of like saying 'if Markworth wasn't injured for 5 years he would have won a Brownlow by now.' This is nothing but wishful thinking and fantasy stuff.
5 years is 5 years. His results are his results. If we want to go on 2009 performance, then lets get CJ back in the side.

2009 B & F

2009
1. Nick Riewoldt- 642
2. Brendon Goddard- 638
3. Leigh Montagna- 635
4. Nick Dal Santo- 618
5. Lenny Hayes- 603
6. Clint Jones- 587
7. Sam Fisher- 531
8. Sam Gilbert- 521
9. Jason Blake- 487
10. Jason Gram- 463

[SaintPav]

Terrible way to talk about one of our stars. Just terrible.

[Con Gorozidis]

Ok hes a gun and a champion. Only nobody knows about it but a few people on Saintsational. Shhhhh!!!!! Lets keep it a secret !!!! Very objective and non-partisan of course. Not even the club knows about it if we go by B & F votes. Just a select elite group of secret special know it alls on here. Seems legit. No blinkers on or anything. Shhhhh! We don't want anyone else finding about this secret 'gunness.' All the stats are wrong. All the reviews are wrong. All the journos are WRONG. All the umps are wrong. All the people who vote for club b & f are WRONG!!!!!! Only we know this hidden secret talent. Shhhhhh!!!

He's probably more of a legend than a gun or a champ. Everyone knows that.

OK hes a 'legend.' He's not top 200 in the AFL but if people want to undo their pants and fondle themselves in a flight of fancy then I do not propose to interfere in their interference. It is a free(ish) world. As long as noone gets hurt, it is all harmless.

[Con Gorozidis]

Terrible way to talk about one of our stars. Just terrible.

I think he is an ok player with lots of attributes and deserves his spot in the side.

Things I like about Gilbo:

Tall
Good in the air
Fast
Tough
Great side-step
Great tackler

I am just arguing against the absurd proposition that he is an elite player in the AFL. He is not in the top 100. Unfortunately his negatives (kicking and decision making) are obstacles that, at 29, have not, and will not be overcome. The game has evolved. Poor disposal and poor decisions are now coach killers. We cannot pretend otherwise. Maybe in the 90s he would have been a gun and AFL top 50. But in 2015 he is far far from it, and every single objective assessment supports me.

[Con Gorozidis]

Just looked it up. Gilbert equal 3rd in B & F in 2010.

Cant find 2011 results outside top 3 (he wasnt in that). What I can find is Brownlow Votes for 2011.

ST KILDA
Nick Dal Santo 28, Leigh Montagna 10, Brendon Goddard 9, Stephen Milne 5, David Armitage, Nick Riewoldt 4, Jason Gram, Clinton Jones, Jack Steven 3, Sam Gilbert 2, Sam Fisher, Ryan Gamble, Ben McEvoy 1

2012 - 21 games - NOT TOP 10 in B & F

Not played enough since 2012 to be even close to top 10.

So really people are living in 2010. That is 5 years ago.

[lewdogs]

I see Gilbert as a 2018 premiership player. Immense tonight in every sense.

[Con Gorozidis]

I see Gilbert as a 2018 premiership player. Immense tonight in every sense.

define 'every sense'?

I assume you don't count disposal in 'every sense'. Just sweep it under the carpet. Apparently it doesnt count.

I can only assume people who love Gilbert are over 50 and dont really care about, weigh, or rate, disposal or decision making. It just doesnt come into the assessment.

[desertsaint]

2009 B & F

2009
1. Nick Riewoldt- 642
2. Brendon Goddard- 638
3. Leigh Montagna- 635
4. Nick Dal Santo- 618
5. Lenny Hayes- 603
6. Clint Jones- 587
7. Sam Fisher- 531
8. Sam Gilbert- 521
9. Jason Blake- 487
10. Jason Gram- 463

so he came 8th in a year we had five AA players.
he also made the AA squad, missing out to players like Scarlett and Enright.
The guy can play. hasn't been back to 2009-10 form for a variety of reasons, but as tonight and the last few weeks have shown, is not far of it lately, and brings a lot to the team.

[Austinnn]

Apparently he had a good game, that's great. We finally worked out that he's a midfielder, fantastic.

As I see it we have two options. Squeeze a few more years out of a reborn midfielder, the same way we turned Aussie Jones into a gun defender and got a few more very serviceable years out of him.

Or we get Dylan Roberton or A.N. Other to play that position and see if we can sell Sam to a team in the premiership window and needing a top up of experience. Dogs? Freo? Tigers?

Personally I'd see if Sam fancies going home and asking Gold Coast if they want him and our 2nd round draft pick for Bennell.