Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
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- WinnersOnly
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Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Is Seb Ross the slowest Saints player to play with us since Stephen Powell?
Honestly what our recruiters saw in him and the current coaching staff see in him as a potential AFL midfielder amazes me?
His lack of affective run, spread and chase against the Lions was quite damning IMO. At one stage he was caught attempting to run out of the centre which is not a negative., but then the Lions played on with he ball and Ross then proceded to walk out of the square with the opposition ruckman whilst his opponents ran the ball forward at speed.
How many times do we see him and others in our team kick off one step because they dont have the run to find room. We have far too many of this style of player in our midfield and cant carry them all. For me when Dunstan is back, Ross is the one that gives and its time to continue to develop the likes of Wright, Minchington, Acres, Webster, Templeton and even Shenton thru the middle over Ross.
Another good VFL player is Curren and like Ross he doesnt have what it takes to make it at the next level.
Honestly what our recruiters saw in him and the current coaching staff see in him as a potential AFL midfielder amazes me?
His lack of affective run, spread and chase against the Lions was quite damning IMO. At one stage he was caught attempting to run out of the centre which is not a negative., but then the Lions played on with he ball and Ross then proceded to walk out of the square with the opposition ruckman whilst his opponents ran the ball forward at speed.
How many times do we see him and others in our team kick off one step because they dont have the run to find room. We have far too many of this style of player in our midfield and cant carry them all. For me when Dunstan is back, Ross is the one that gives and its time to continue to develop the likes of Wright, Minchington, Acres, Webster, Templeton and even Shenton thru the middle over Ross.
Another good VFL player is Curren and like Ross he doesnt have what it takes to make it at the next level.
Last edited by WinnersOnly on Mon 02 Mar 2015 5:41pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
WinnersOnly wrote:Is Seb Ross the slowest Saints player to play with us since Stephen Powell?
Honestly what our recruiters saw in him and the current coaching staff see in him as a potential AFL midfielder amazes me?
His lack of affective run, spread and chase against the Lions was quite damning IMO. At one stage he was caught attempting to run out of the centre which is not a negative., but then the Lions played on with he ball and Ross then proceded to walk out of the square with the opposition ruckman whilst his opponents ran the ball forward at speed.
How many times do we see him and others in our team kick off one step because they dont have the run to find room. We have far too many of this style of player in our midfield and cant carry them all. For me when Dunstan is back, Ross is the one that gives and its time to continue to develop the likes of Wright, Minchington, Acres, Webster, Templeton and even Shenton thru the middle over Ross.
Another good VFL player is Curren but like Ross he doesnt have what it takes to make it at the next level.
I don't think he is any slower than Lenny but he doesn't really have his smarts. Hopefully he will continue to improve. He has slightly every year.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
i just don't agree with you on Ross. Curran? Maybe, but too early in the season to say.WinnersOnly wrote:Is Seb Ross the slowest Saints player to play with us since Stephen Powell?
Honestly what our recruiters saw in him and the current coaching staff see in him as a potential AFL midfielder amazes me?
His lack of affective run, spread and chase against the Lions was quite damning IMO. At one stage he was caught attempting to run out of the centre which is not a negative., but then the Lions played on with he ball and Ross then proceded to walk out of the square with the opposition ruckman whilst his opponents ran the ball forward at speed.
How many times do we see him and others in our team kick off one step because they dont have the run to find room. We have far too many of this style of player in our midfield and cant carry them all. For me when Dunstan is back, Ross is the one that gives and its time to continue to develop the likes of Wright, Minchington, Acres, Webster, Templeton and even Shenton thru the middle over Ross.
Another good VFL player is Curren but like Ross he doesnt have what it takes to make it at the next level.
- Con Gorozidis
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
I am not worried about his pace because he knows how to win the ball and does win it a lot in close.
I am woried about his kicking though. If he was a precise kick hed be an absolute gun but sadly hes not.
He also doesnt have the side step/change of direction of a Lenny or the hip swivel turn of a Mitchell.
Hes more of a straight line guy.
Needs to get precise with his kicks to rise above being a GOP imho.
Worst case scenario for Seb is Mark McGough but I think he has more talent than that.
I am woried about his kicking though. If he was a precise kick hed be an absolute gun but sadly hes not.
He also doesnt have the side step/change of direction of a Lenny or the hip swivel turn of a Mitchell.
Hes more of a straight line guy.
Needs to get precise with his kicks to rise above being a GOP imho.
Worst case scenario for Seb is Mark McGough but I think he has more talent than that.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
He's improving incrementally, similar to Armitage in his first couple of seasons. I thought Armitage would never get the tank or leg speed sufficient to become a really good player. I was wrong. Seb's cousin was in a very similar trajectory, and it took until his 4th season to blossom. Geary had a similar trajectory.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Yep still early doors. As long as he shows improvement then i'm happy. If AFL was easy everyone would be doing it. Not many rock up and are good from day one.cwrcyn wrote:He's improving incrementally, similar to Armitage in his first couple of seasons. I thought Armitage would never get the tank or leg speed sufficient to become a really good player. I was wrong. Seb's cousin was in a very similar trajectory, and it took until his 4th season to blossom. Geary had a similar trajectory.
Hardly any.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
cwrcyn wrote:He's improving incrementally, similar to Armitage in his first couple of seasons. I thought Armitage would never get the tank or leg speed sufficient to become a really good player. I was wrong. Seb's cousin was in a very similar trajectory, and it took until his 4th season to blossom. Geary had a similar trajectory.
Watson evidently took a couple of sort cuts, it would seem.
Along with a lot of hard work, I might add.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
It worries me that we have no midfielder who can really stamp themselves on games regularly. Armo and Steven can be great but are inconsistent, Dunstan should keep improving and Acres maybe, but Seb needs to find another gear quickly, but I don't think he has one, and the rest of our options don't show much. The midfield will be our achilles this season.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
saynta wrote:Watson evidently took a couple of sort cuts, it would seem.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Is not wracking up near enough touches for someone that lacks pace. He needs to start finding it 20 times plus consistently,not 10,and 12,and 7,and 17 and 8
Bring back the Lockett era
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Brilliant bigcarl brilliant................... have you put that link on the Essendope thread..... it's so close to the truth. Fantastic.bigcarl wrote:saynta wrote:Watson evidently took a couple of sort cuts, it would seem.
Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Well Seb is not yet 22 and he's only played 27 games. Yes he's slow but if he can build up those thighs he could be that chug along style like Mitchell and Diesel Williams, deceptively getting to a lot of contests and racking up the possessions. I like the way he seems to have time on the ball and he's got a great handball that opens things up and links up play creatively like he did well in the Brissy game a few times. His kicking is a worry - like Newnes, they both have an awkward technique where they can't get the ball to foot smoothly. He still doesn't look like he believes he belongs out there, lacking assertiveness to take charge and really go after the footy. I hear he's quite a shy fellow and it kind of shows on the ground. If he can get to that 50 game mark maybe it will bring some confidence. The players who make it are the ones who have a fierce inner belief self-actualising them. Deep down they believe they have something unique no one else does that can make the difference between winning and losing. I think Ross can be that handballing machine we need, spearing it out to open things up but he's got to find an inner strength within himself because they coaches can only do so much encouraging him.jonesy wrote:Is not wracking up near enough touches for someone that lacks pace. He needs to start finding it 20 times plus consistently,not 10,and 12,and 7,and 17 and 8
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Seb has quietly built up his stats every year. He is improving and is on the right path so far. I would love it to be quicker but he at least keeps improving. Speed doesn't need to be the strength of every player on the field.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
I think he has improved heaps.
He gets to the right spots, makes space and his smarts are improving heaps.
For me he is one of the few true mids we have coming through, he needs to make it to B+ stage, ala Armo.
Hope he raises his fitness levels, this will get him there IMO.
He gets to the right spots, makes space and his smarts are improving heaps.
For me he is one of the few true mids we have coming through, he needs to make it to B+ stage, ala Armo.
Hope he raises his fitness levels, this will get him there IMO.
Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
He's not quick, skilful or a goal scoring threat. He needs to become a dominant ball winner 30 touch player to add value to our midfield. Even know he is only 21 he needs to be in our best 22 considering where our list is at or doubt he will ever make it.
Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Don't expect him to be like Jobe.
He's actually more like Pendlebury.
Seb is not quick, but when you see the game unfold before you, and you respond accordingly...that makes up for lack of pace.
Not quick, but the game slows down for him, ability to see it before it happens.
Great hands, matrix hands.
He's actually more like Pendlebury.
Seb is not quick, but when you see the game unfold before you, and you respond accordingly...that makes up for lack of pace.
Not quick, but the game slows down for him, ability to see it before it happens.
Great hands, matrix hands.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
SainterK wrote:
He's actually more like Pendlebury.
Thats like saying Saunders is 'like Aker'.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Seb will play most of this year as a 22 year old...
I am not over inflating the importance of SC/DT scores, and realise there is more to footy, but the fact is, midfielders need to consistently score 100+ to be considered any good...
From what I have observed regarding development, the very best players may already start getting 100+ consistently at age 20/21, but it is also common to score 100+ only once or twice at ~20, then few times at ~21 and a few more at 22, and only become consistent at 23... This is the track we hope Seb is on.. he did manage a couple of high scores last year and even 1or 2 the year before... this year as a 22 year old, he needs to score 100+ (or be in the best players, whichever measure you prefer) in around 30-35% of his full games... at minimum ... then step up in consistency next year
Big steps up in quality/consistency are rare for ages >23. I am sure people will think of examples where it happens.. but it is not common.. and the fact is, nothing has really hampered Ross in a major way.. he has had a pretty consistent run of pre-seasons and games played .. good to see him improving his tank over the summer with PBs over 2km... allows us to keep hoping
I am not over inflating the importance of SC/DT scores, and realise there is more to footy, but the fact is, midfielders need to consistently score 100+ to be considered any good...
From what I have observed regarding development, the very best players may already start getting 100+ consistently at age 20/21, but it is also common to score 100+ only once or twice at ~20, then few times at ~21 and a few more at 22, and only become consistent at 23... This is the track we hope Seb is on.. he did manage a couple of high scores last year and even 1or 2 the year before... this year as a 22 year old, he needs to score 100+ (or be in the best players, whichever measure you prefer) in around 30-35% of his full games... at minimum ... then step up in consistency next year
Big steps up in quality/consistency are rare for ages >23. I am sure people will think of examples where it happens.. but it is not common.. and the fact is, nothing has really hampered Ross in a major way.. he has had a pretty consistent run of pre-seasons and games played .. good to see him improving his tank over the summer with PBs over 2km... allows us to keep hoping
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
SuperDuper wrote:Seb will play most of this year as a 22 year old...
I am not over inflating the importance of SC/DT scores, and realise there is more to footy, but the fact is, midfielders need to consistently score 100+ to be considered any good...
From what I have observed regarding development, the very best players may already start getting 100+ consistently at age 20/21, but it is also common to score 100+ only once or twice at ~20, then few times at ~21 and a few more at 22, and only become consistent at 23... This is the track we hope Seb is on.. he did manage a couple of high scores last year and even 1or 2 the year before... this year as a 22 year old, he needs to score 100+ (or be in the best players, whichever measure you prefer) in around 30-35% of his full games... at minimum ... then step up in consistency next year
Big steps up in quality/consistency are rare for ages >23. I am sure people will think of examples where it happens.. but it is not common.. and the fact is, nothing has really hampered Ross in a major way.. he has had a pretty consistent run of pre-seasons and games played .. good to see him improving his tank over the summer with PBs over 2km... allows us to keep hoping
I'm sure that's true of some but not every player is Joel Selwood or Olly Wines. He isn't fast out of the blocks but he is progressing. He hasn't played 30 games yet.
Compare Joey to him ..I chose 2004 when Joey was 21 so a pretty reasonable comparison. Seb is ahead in disposals by 4.6 a game and compares pretty well in most others.
http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_p ... fopt2=2004 Joey had a worse year the year before but played a similar amount of games. He had a 28 disposal game versus Geelong when he got a decent amount of minutes. I'm pretty happy with Seb, he isn't showy but just quietly goes about his business.
Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
gringo wrote:I'm pretty happy with Seb, he isn't showy but just quietly goes about his business.
fair comment
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Sweet, all he needs to do is develop elite pace, elite endurance,elite kicking & goal kicking and we have another joeygringo wrote:SuperDuper wrote:Seb will play most of this year as a 22 year old...
I am not over inflating the importance of SC/DT scores, and realise there is more to footy, but the fact is, midfielders need to consistently score 100+ to be considered any good...
From what I have observed regarding development, the very best players may already start getting 100+ consistently at age 20/21, but it is also common to score 100+ only once or twice at ~20, then few times at ~21 and a few more at 22, and only become consistent at 23... This is the track we hope Seb is on.. he did manage a couple of high scores last year and even 1or 2 the year before... this year as a 22 year old, he needs to score 100+ (or be in the best players, whichever measure you prefer) in around 30-35% of his full games... at minimum ... then step up in consistency next year
Big steps up in quality/consistency are rare for ages >23. I am sure people will think of examples where it happens.. but it is not common.. and the fact is, nothing has really hampered Ross in a major way.. he has had a pretty consistent run of pre-seasons and games played .. good to see him improving his tank over the summer with PBs over 2km... allows us to keep hoping
I'm sure that's true of some but not every player is Joel Selwood or Olly Wines. He isn't fast out of the blocks but he is progressing. He hasn't played 30 games yet.
Compare Joey to him ..I chose 2004 when Joey was 21 so a pretty reasonable comparison. Seb is ahead in disposals by 4.6 a game and compares pretty well in most others.
http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_p ... fopt2=2004 Joey had a worse year the year before but played a similar amount of games. He had a 28 disposal game versus Geelong when he got a decent amount of minutes. I'm pretty happy with Seb, he isn't showy but just quietly goes about his business.
His business at the moment is quietly collecting 14 disposals and 3 tackles a game, he'll need to start doing a lot more than that in the next couple of years.
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Speaking of Joey!dragit wrote:Sweet, all he needs to do is develop elite pace, elite endurance,elite kicking & goal kicking and we have another joeygringo wrote:SuperDuper wrote:Seb will play most of this year as a 22 year old...
I am not over inflating the importance of SC/DT scores, and realise there is more to footy, but the fact is, midfielders need to consistently score 100+ to be considered any good...
From what I have observed regarding development, the very best players may already start getting 100+ consistently at age 20/21, but it is also common to score 100+ only once or twice at ~20, then few times at ~21 and a few more at 22, and only become consistent at 23... This is the track we hope Seb is on.. he did manage a couple of high scores last year and even 1or 2 the year before... this year as a 22 year old, he needs to score 100+ (or be in the best players, whichever measure you prefer) in around 30-35% of his full games... at minimum ... then step up in consistency next year
Big steps up in quality/consistency are rare for ages >23. I am sure people will think of examples where it happens.. but it is not common.. and the fact is, nothing has really hampered Ross in a major way.. he has had a pretty consistent run of pre-seasons and games played .. good to see him improving his tank over the summer with PBs over 2km... allows us to keep hoping
I'm sure that's true of some but not every player is Joel Selwood or Olly Wines. He isn't fast out of the blocks but he is progressing. He hasn't played 30 games yet.
Compare Joey to him ..I chose 2004 when Joey was 21 so a pretty reasonable comparison. Seb is ahead in disposals by 4.6 a game and compares pretty well in most others.
http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_p ... fopt2=2004 Joey had a worse year the year before but played a similar amount of games. He had a 28 disposal game versus Geelong when he got a decent amount of minutes. I'm pretty happy with Seb, he isn't showy but just quietly goes about his business.
His business at the moment is quietly collecting 14 disposals and 3 tackles a game, he'll need to start doing a lot more than that in the next couple of years.
Tom Boyd and Tom Scully aside Joey and Armo must be the two most over-paid blokes in the AFL.
Man im going to cop it for this
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Re: Seb Ross lack of running capacities...
Haha, you love it con!
I reckon joey & Armo would get a similar wage (whatever that is) at a dozen other clubs, which suggests they are being paid around their market value.
I reckon joey & Armo would get a similar wage (whatever that is) at a dozen other clubs, which suggests they are being paid around their market value.