Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

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Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby parkeysainter » Sat 07 Oct 2017 7:01am

See Seb Ross' stats over his six years:
https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players ... _Ross.html

All those people calling for him to be delisted a couple of years back must be eating humble pie today. Seb can't run, can't kick, can't get the football, can't play midfield, etc.

I think his rise can also potentially be paralleled by the likes of others such as Dunstan, Billings and Acres in the next 2 years. I actually believe the three of them are ahead of Seb at the end of the 4 year mark in their careers in comparison. That is very exciting in itself. I also believe Gresham is way ahead of all the above in comparison at the same point in their careers which is even more exciting to fathom. He has just finished his 2nd year!

Anothet point....kids need to be given time to mature and to be able to withstand the rigours of AFL footy. Seb is a classic example of this and the benefits that can be reaped from it. He has another 7-10 top class seasons in him now. It's a massive win.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby Scollop » Sat 07 Oct 2017 9:25am

parkeysainter wrote:See Seb Ross' stats over his six years:
https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players ... _Ross.html

All those people calling for him to be delisted a couple of years back must be eating humble pie today. Seb can't run, can't kick, can't get the football, can't play midfield, etc.

I think his rise can also potentially be paralleled by the likes of others such as Dunstan, Billings and Acres in the next 2 years. I actually believe the three of them are ahead of Seb at the end of the 4 year mark in their careers in comparison. That is very exciting in itself. I also believe Gresham is way ahead of all the above in comparison at the same point in their careers which is even more exciting to fathom. He has just finished his 2nd year!

Anothet point....kids need to be given time to mature and to be able to withstand the rigours of AFL footy. Seb is a classic example of this and the benefits that can be reaped from it. He has another 7-10 top class seasons in him now. It's a massive win.


I don't know what it proves. Is it self motivation, is it our club's development and training staff, is it the assistant coaches and head cockroach that played a big part? I think Seb has benefited from a fantastic club culture over the last few years and he feels like he belongs.

Does it mean perhaps that kids from the bush do it tougher than the city peeps, and therefore are mentally tougher. Con G will love me for saying that, but then again...

It might go to prove that kids from good families and with good character will work harder to give themselves every opportunity. Con G will hate me for saying that. He has seen that the club was in rebuild and that there were guys around him whereby they all needed to play a part for the team to improve and he embraced that. He also took it upon himself to be a leader.

If you expand on the 'good character' trait it might also mean that youngsters need to mentored well and the club has a part to play in welfare. Youngsters that perhaps have a good life balance and have interests outside of football that are complimentary also assists them to focus on becoming better footballers. Maybe...

Anyhow, Well done to Seb
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby whiskers3614 » Sat 07 Oct 2017 9:46am

Might also prove that other potential B*F contenders had either poor or inconsistent seasons or were over the hill!
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby spert » Sat 07 Oct 2017 10:07am

Improved consistently in a team where too many under-performed IMO. I hope he can get AA next season- just needs to be a bit more attacking in his game.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby saynta » Sat 07 Oct 2017 10:55am

Said it took him a couple of years before it clicked with him what was needed to be successful.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby magnifisaint » Sat 07 Oct 2017 11:03am

it proves he has a lot of ability
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby carn_sainter » Sat 07 Oct 2017 11:26am

I can't go for this kind of inductive reasoning. It took Seb a few seasons and now he has played 2 very good seasons. But that's all. For every player like Seb who was unremarkable for 4 seasons and at a crossroads, as many fail as succeed.

Good on him. magnifisaint is right that it proves Seb is a very good player.

But one example absolutely cannot be the foundation for some kind of general law of player development.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby saint-stu » Sat 07 Oct 2017 11:55am

carn_sainter wrote:I can't go for this kind of inductive reasoning. It took Seb a few seasons and now he has played 2 very good seasons. But that's all. For every player like Seb who was unremarkable for 4 seasons and at a crossroads, as many fail as succeed.

Good on him. magnifisaint is right that it proves Seb is a very good player.

But one example absolutely cannot be the foundation for some kind of general law of player development.


It's true that many fail, but it does prove that you can't judge players until they get to about their 5th year. Jack Steven, Brendon Goddard and many others have been the same.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby SaintPav » Sat 07 Oct 2017 12:00pm

I think Seb can go up another level as well.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby CQ SAINT » Sat 07 Oct 2017 1:55pm

It proves I was wrong. Humbly aplogise. Well done Seb. I will and have reserved my early calls on players since.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby parkeysainter » Sat 07 Oct 2017 3:41pm

saint-stu wrote:
carn_sainter wrote:I can't go for this kind of inductive reasoning. It took Seb a few seasons and now he has played 2 very good seasons. But that's all. For every player like Seb who was unremarkable for 4 seasons and at a crossroads, as many fail as succeed.

Good on him. magnifisaint is right that it proves Seb is a very good player.

But one example absolutely cannot be the foundation for some kind of general law of player development.


It's true that many fail, but it does prove that you can't judge players until they get to about their 5th year. Jack Steven, Brendon Goddard and many others have been the same.


Agreed.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby parkeysainter » Sat 07 Oct 2017 3:52pm

saint-stu wrote:
carn_sainter wrote:I can't go for this kind of inductive reasoning. It took Seb a few seasons and now he has played 2 very good seasons. But that's all. For every player like Seb who was unremarkable for 4 seasons and at a crossroads, as many fail as succeed.

Good on him. magnifisaint is right that it proves Seb is a very good player.

But one example absolutely cannot be the foundation for some kind of general law of player development.


It's true that many fail, but it does prove that you can't judge players until they get to about their 5th year. Jack Steven, Brendon Goddard and many others have been the same.


Agreed.

Trying to get Saints fans to also realise it might take young fellas like Paddy, Goddard, McKenzie, Long, etc. a couple of more years to still come good.

There is an old Chinese proverb:
"One moment of patience may ward off great disaster. One moment of impatience may ruin a whole life."
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby stkfc1 » Sat 07 Oct 2017 3:54pm

SaintPav wrote:I think Seb can go up another level as well.


Definitely. Seb is an accumulator at present. Gets a lot of the ball but not super damaging. In the next season or two we'll see more attacking flair as his confidence grows from belonging at AFL level to dominating at AFL level. Those 30+ possession games will turn into 30+ possessions and 1 to 3 goal games. He's going to be a beauty and legend of the club. Calling it now.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby Con Gorozidis » Sat 07 Oct 2017 3:59pm

All those people calling for him to be delisted a couple of years back must be eating humble pie today.


Which was all of nobody.
Cant remember anyone ever calling for him to be de-listed.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby MickThomas » Sat 07 Oct 2017 4:07pm

Con Gorozidis wrote:
All those people calling for him to be delisted a couple of years back must be eating humble pie today.


Which was all of nobody.
Cant remember anyone ever calling for him to be de-listed.


There were a few, not a lot, but a small number,
who didn't have Seb in the 'dud' club a la Lonie or TDL,
but they did express little confidence in him and said
he could be traded for a better player.
As I recall.
Con Gorozides isn't a troll, he has opinions like we all do.
If you disagree with him and attack personally
rather than use logic and facts,
you're either lazy or your comment can be viewed as trolling.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby Con Gorozidis » Sat 07 Oct 2017 4:19pm

MickThomas wrote:
Con Gorozidis wrote:
All those people calling for him to be delisted a couple of years back must be eating humble pie today.


Which was all of nobody.
Cant remember anyone ever calling for him to be de-listed.


There were a few, not a lot, but a small number,
who didn't have Seb in the 'dud' club a la Lonie or TDL,
but they did express little confidence in him and said
he could be traded for a better player.
As I recall.


I recall there was plenty of talk that he was off to Essendon.
But that is different to 'de-listing'.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby The Fireman » Sat 07 Oct 2017 4:48pm

It proves if he is our best then we may be in trouble...the talent drops off a fair bit.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby MickThomas » Sat 07 Oct 2017 4:51pm

Con Gorozidis wrote:
MickThomas wrote:
Con Gorozidis wrote:
All those people calling for him to be delisted a couple of years back must be eating humble pie today.


Which was all of nobody.
Cant remember anyone ever calling for him to be de-listed.


There were a few, not a lot, but a small number,
who didn't have Seb in the 'dud' club a la Lonie or TDL,
but they did express little confidence in him and said
he could be traded for a better player.
As I recall.


I recall there was plenty of talk that he was off to Essendon.
But that is different to 'de-listing'.

Ok I stand corrected.
The Injectors suggestion was based on being related to Jab Watson, with posters really stretching assumptions badly.
Con Gorozides isn't a troll, he has opinions like we all do.
If you disagree with him and attack personally
rather than use logic and facts,
you're either lazy or your comment can be viewed as trolling.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby parkeysainter » Sat 07 Oct 2017 5:01pm

Con Gorozidis wrote:
All those people calling for him to be delisted a couple of years back must be eating humble pie today.


Which was all of nobody.
Cant remember anyone ever calling for him to be de-listed.


I remember many a Saint fan indicating as such. Not a majority of course but the minority of idiots that don't understand footy. Plus they're always the loudest of course. Tis why I can't stand going to the footy sometimes.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby parkeysainter » Sat 07 Oct 2017 5:05pm

stkfc1 wrote:
SaintPav wrote:I think Seb can go up another level as well.


Definitely. Seb is an accumulator at present. Gets a lot of the ball but not super damaging. In the next season or two we'll see more attacking flair as his confidence grows from belonging at AFL level to dominating at AFL level. Those 30+ possession games will turn into 30+ possessions and 1 to 3 goal games. He's going to be a beauty and legend of the club. Calling it now.


Totally agree. Potential Brownlow top 3 material, especially if the Saints push higher up the ladder and win more games.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby saynta » Sat 07 Oct 2017 5:48pm

Con Gorozidis wrote:
All those people calling for him to be delisted a couple of years back must be eating humble pie today.


Which was all of nobody.
Cant remember anyone ever calling for him to be de-listed.

Traded though.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby BringBackMadDog » Sat 07 Oct 2017 6:10pm

The Fireman wrote:It proves if he is our best then we may be in trouble...the talent drops off a fair bit.

All australian top 40, top 6 or 7 in every important stat in the AFL, quick, tough, great hands, reads the play well, runs all day. Yep we are in loads of trouble :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby Zed » Sat 07 Oct 2017 9:10pm

I have generally been a fan of Seb's throughout his AFL and have never wanted him traded. In recent years I was critical of his lack of leg speed. He's obviously worked hard on fixing that - or at least has improved his capacity to spread quickly from a contest.

Now my only criticism of Seb is that he turns the ball over too often. If he fixes that, then he can become a genuine AA - but he's still a way off in my opinion.
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby To the top » Sat 07 Oct 2017 10:20pm

Ross is a deserving winner in 2017 and played several influential games

My concern however is that we finished mid table and, by my reading at least, some of the names in our 10 leading vote winners reflect where we finished on the ladder and our percentage being less than 100, again

And this is where the progress of the likes of Freeman, Dunstan, Acres, McCartin, Goddard plus the return of Armitage are vital to the side progressing

These players have to start pushing into our top 10 - which reflects approximately half our side

Plus the likes of White who to me shows the necessary

We can not rely on Draft Picks 7 and 8 to immediately impact on the side with the best outcome in 2018 being these players gain experience as support players

Of our top 10 this season my assessment is that 4 of them need to be put under pressure to retain their positions in the side for us to go to the next level in 2018 and onwards

Particularly the likes of Bruce need to start influencing the results of games - and I would not necessarily look for that to be as a key forward if he can regain his athletic mojo

Then there is Battle where the question will be put to him in 2018 you would expect

Then we get to our rucks noting the reliances put on ruck divisions during the 2017 finals series probably vindicated the views of a former Coach

They have to have influence in field play

Given the influx of names who contributed little in 2017 for reasons and some others replicating the trajectory of Ross plus the cream on the cake from the Draft I would look for improvement in 2018 even allowing for the retirements of Riewoldt and Montagna

But all other sides will be looking to improve as well so there is the challenge

In regards the craving for a super star, St Kilda has not lacked super stars across its history but its record is as abysmal as it is

Perhaps there is a message there somewhere
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Re: Seb Ross B & F Proves Something

Postby skeptic » Sat 07 Oct 2017 11:57pm

There was apparently only one person on this forum that saw potential in Seb, and it never gets old listening to them tell us about it. They are like the Jaxons of talent identification
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