Saints drop 4 players.

This unofficial St Kilda Saints fan forum is for people of all ages to chat Saints Footy and all posts must be respectful.

Moderators: Saintsational Administrators, Saintsational Moderators

David-Lee
Club Player
Posts: 493
Joined: Sat 10 Jun 2017 2:01pm
Has thanked: 35 times
Been thanked: 41 times

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686640Post David-Lee »

The standard at every club is play to win...play to get into finals...play to win the grand final.

But are we still doing this? Surely no reasonable human (I know we cant be Saint fans and be considered anything by masochistic lunatics :twisted: ) can say we will win the grand final. Can we get into the 8? Sure. Anything can happen if we win. But planning for 2018...as we were told in 2015 as the year we go to the top...why aren't we playing Battle, Long and the whole farking sandlot? We can only win. I am not talking about everyone in so we get done by 100 but surely let whoever we need games into have a run. If Battle goes out on form where does that leave others? Is it form or games to win that we are hoping for....or is it getting senior games into boys needing a run? Leave Battle. So we lose by 80 instead of 55. So what!!


saintspremiers
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 25303
Joined: Tue 01 Feb 2005 4:25pm
Location: Trump Tower
Has thanked: 142 times
Been thanked: 284 times

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686646Post saintspremiers »

David-Lee wrote:The standard at every club is play to win...play to get into finals...play to win the grand final.

But are we still doing this? Surely no reasonable human (I know we cant be Saint fans and be considered anything by masochistic lunatics :twisted: ) can say we will win the grand final. Can we get into the 8? Sure. Anything can happen if we win. But planning for 2018...as we were told in 2015 as the year we go to the top...why aren't we playing Battle, Long and the whole farking sandlot? We can only win. I am not talking about everyone in so we get done by 100 but surely let whoever we need games into have a run. If Battle goes out on form where does that leave others? Is it form or games to win that we are hoping for....or is it getting senior games into boys needing a run? Leave Battle. So we lose by 80 instead of 55. So what!!
Battle, Long and DMac playing gives us NOTHING against the best side in the comp at home.

Are you fairdinkum or trolling suggesting it doesn't matter if we lose by 80 points?

Any true Saints fan wouldn't dream of saying garbage like that.

A huge loss is a disaster this week IMO. I'm not expecting a win, just a competitive loss.


i am Melbourne Skies - sometimes Blue Skies, Grey Skies, even Partly Cloudy Skies.
User avatar
Devilhead
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 7922
Joined: Mon 08 Mar 2004 11:56pm
Has thanked: 122 times
Been thanked: 1082 times

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686647Post Devilhead »

WOW we dropped 4 players like 3 or 4 clubs do every other week :roll:


The Devil makes work for idle hands!!!
User avatar
samuraisaint
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 5681
Joined: Sun 25 Sep 2011 3:23pm
Location: M32
Has thanked: 762 times
Been thanked: 734 times

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686651Post samuraisaint »

Proph3t of egan wrote:3 debutants this year, maybe by the end of the year we can bring in freeman and rice and make it 5
Like.

I have never thought we'd make the 8 and play finals this year, but we are on track to do what I thought we would and could do - win as many games as last year and finish ninth or tenth and hold ground with a far more difficult fixture. If we can do this and get some more games into our younger players, which we look likely to do, it will have been a good development year,
Probably unlikely to get Gilbert back this year and Armo has to only be an outside chance to return in 2017 - especially if the next two games are losses - and this creates opportunities for the likes of Rice and Freeman to play some games in the back end of this season.
I thought the club made a statement that Freeman wouldn't play seniors this year though?


Your friendly neighbourhood samurai.
Proph3t of egan
Club Player
Posts: 516
Joined: Sun 08 May 2016 8:02pm

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686661Post Proph3t of egan »

samuraisaint wrote:
Proph3t of egan wrote:3 debutants this year, maybe by the end of the year we can bring in freeman and rice and make it 5
Like.

I have never thought we'd make the 8 and play finals this year, but we are on track to do what I thought we would and could do - win as many games as last year and finish ninth or tenth and hold ground with a far more difficult fixture. If we can do this and get some more games into our younger players, which we look likely to do, it will have been a good development year,
Probably unlikely to get Gilbert back this year and Armo has to only be an outside chance to return in 2017 - especially if the next two games are losses - and this creates opportunities for the likes of Rice and Freeman to play some games in the back end of this season.
I thought the club made a statement that Freeman wouldn't play seniors this year though?
Ricoh said it was unlikely, and probably is, but if by the game against north Melbourne we can't make the 8 and Freeman is tearing it up in the VFL, why shouldn't we? We got him so he would play AFL, not VFL


Fortius quo Fidelius means Strength through Loyalty. . . I think
User avatar
Spinner
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 8502
Joined: Sat 02 Dec 2006 3:40pm
Location: Victoria
Has thanked: 185 times
Been thanked: 133 times

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686662Post Spinner »

skeptic wrote:
Johnny Member wrote:
WellardSaint wrote:the elephant in the room...Maverick Weller.

Remember him? He's in the leadership group.
Is he still carrying that ankle soreness?
He got 17 disposals for Zebs, and 8 tackles,
whereas Blake Acres got 26 and 8 tackles, but had a hard tag all day.
Go figure
Well to be fair, Wellard was put into the leadership group when we were a bottom 4 team with no leaders.

Maybe (and hopefully) we've improved. And when that occurs, some get left behind.
I still maintain that Mav was bloody great last season and earned what he got... has been way down this season and deserved to be dropped.
No need to write him off, let him work his way back in.

He was bloody great last year. Marking target high half forward, strong and agile around the forward 50.

Clearly lost a bit of that agility this year, just hasn't been able to show his tricks which sounds like due to injury.


User avatar
Johnny Member
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 4157
Joined: Thu 05 Oct 2006 12:27pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686667Post Johnny Member »

Was he 'great' last year comparative to the rest of our team? Or 'great' in the context of the entire competition?
Last edited by Johnny Member on Fri 21 Jul 2017 10:55am, edited 1 time in total.


User avatar
Johnny Member
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 4157
Joined: Thu 05 Oct 2006 12:27pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686669Post Johnny Member »

Last year he averaged 16.4 Disposals and 3.9 Marks per game.

This season he averages 17.1 Disposals and 4.5 Marks.

Last season he averaged 2.0 Shots at Goal and 3.8 Tackles per week.

This season he averages 2.1 Shots at Goal 3.2 Tackles.


So he's up in everything except he has had 0.6 Tackles less per week this season.


Maybe Mav is just being Mav still - but the rest of the group has improved and gone past him?



Maybe, shock horror, just maybe Saints fans may have overrated him and seen him as a superstar whereas in fact he was a average-decent player in a terrible team?


User avatar
Johnny Member
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 4157
Joined: Thu 05 Oct 2006 12:27pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686673Post Johnny Member »

And that's not a knock on Mav necessarily.

It is what it is.

As teams improve, not everyone on the list is capable of taking the next step. If a team is to improve, everyone has to get better or be replaced by someone who is already better. If that doesn't occur, then guess what? You don't improve!



I still think we have probably about 10 guys in our team each week that aren't good enough to part of a team that would contend for a premiership. Of that 10, I reckon 4-5 are capable of getting better and improving to the point that they could be part of a legitimate Premiership contending team. So that leaves about 5-6 that we need to replace with better players. Either with young guys already on our list that are improving, with young guys from the Draft that will become good players, or with players from other clubs.


It's highly possible that Weller just isn't up to it. Maybe what he's producing last season and this season is his best? And maybe his best is no longer good enough to make it into our best 22?


That's not good news for Mav if true - but it's fantastic news for the club.


User avatar
WellardSaint
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 7862
Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
Has thanked: 1681 times
Been thanked: 781 times

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686711Post WellardSaint »

Johnny Member wrote:And that's not a knock on Mav necessarily.

It is what it is.

As teams improve, not everyone on the list is capable of taking the next step. If a team is to improve, everyone has to get better or be replaced by someone who is already better. If that doesn't occur, then guess what? You don't improve!



I still think we have probably about 10 guys in our team each week that aren't good enough to part of a team that would contend for a premiership. Of that 10, I reckon 4-5 are capable of getting better and improving to the point that they could be part of a legitimate Premiership contending team. So that leaves about 5-6 that we need to replace with better players. Either with young guys already on our list that are improving, with young guys from the Draft that will become good players, or with players from other clubs.


It's highly possible that Weller just isn't up to it. Maybe what he's producing last season and this season is his best? And maybe his best is no longer good enough to make it into our best 22?


That's not good news for Mav if true - but it's fantastic news for the club.
Quite a good summation, very good points.

In case some think you're suggesting that the 10 guys are "list cloggers", you're not-
these guys are part of our best 22 at the moment, are doing a job well- when we win- but they don't possess the skills or ability to improve those skills,
and/or the right attitude or approach to go the next level.
But as the team sits now, they are part of the team and are helping the journey- but they won't necessarily be part of a finals campaign.
Our next few drafts should get some players like Kelly or similar who will push others out, and make the team better.
I think if Mav can't conquer this injury (ankle?) and can't go to the next level, he will simply stay in the VFL
as we will have others who will overtake him and do better.

It's all part of improving the team.


A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤🤍🖤 and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
User avatar
saintsRrising
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 30034
Joined: Mon 15 Mar 2004 11:07am
Location: Melbourne
Has thanked: 700 times
Been thanked: 1212 times

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686717Post saintsRrising »

Johnny Member wrote:

Maybe, shock horror, just maybe Saints fans may have overrated him and seen him as a superstar whereas in fact he was a average-decent player in a terrible team?
Who ever rated Mav as a superstar?

Personally I think he has been carrying an ankle injury for most of the season.

So lets see how he goes next season before writing him off.


But certainly IF the Saints keep improving, including our playing personal, then players are going to get squeezed out of the 22, and Mav may well be one of them.


Flying the World in comfort thanks to FF Points....
Proph3t of egan
Club Player
Posts: 516
Joined: Sun 08 May 2016 8:02pm

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686718Post Proph3t of egan »

saintsRrising wrote:
Johnny Member wrote:

Maybe, shock horror, just maybe Saints fans may have overrated him and seen him as a superstar whereas in fact he was a average-decent player in a terrible team?
Who ever rated Mav as a superstar?

Personally I think he has been carrying an ankle injury for most of the season.

So lets see how he goes next season before writing him off.


But certainly IF the Saints keep improving, including our playing personal, then players are going to get squeezed out of the 22, and Mav may well be one of them.
Had MAV been more accurate this year we would be singing his praises I reckon, if he fixes it next year, there is a place in the team for his intensity


Fortius quo Fidelius means Strength through Loyalty. . . I think
User avatar
Johnny Member
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 4157
Joined: Thu 05 Oct 2006 12:27pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Saints drop 4 players.

Post: # 1686721Post Johnny Member »

WellardSaint wrote:
In case some think you're suggesting that the 10 guys are "list cloggers", you're not-
these guys are part of our best 22 at the moment, are doing a job well- when we win- but they don't possess the skills or ability to improve those skills,
and/or the right attitude or approach to go the next level.
But as the team sits now, they are part of the team and are helping the journey- but they won't necessarily be part of a finals campaign.
Or they're still young and developing, and will have the capacity to be part of a really good team.


Post Reply