Probably got it wrong at the selection table

[Bluthy]

Easy in hindsight I guess. But I didn't like McKenzie for Webster. Webster had stepped up his kicking game - still doing some clangers but much more consistent and penetrating with his kicking from the back. He gave us a much needed other foil to Joey and Robbo's run and gun from the back. Maybe Rice would have been a good selection.

Roo could use a rest. Paddy needs games but Bruce has been our hard working central target bringing the ball to ground. Without him we lacked structure.

Dunstan and Stevens maybe meant we were overloaded with slow onballers who couldn't really play anywhere else.

Gresh could use a rest and a chance to develop as a genuine midfielder. He seems to have been a bit worn down in that tough small forward role.

[Linton Lodger]

Yep, had that feeling on Thurs night.

One small forward short, one too many inside mids and DMac instead of Savage.

[SemperFidelis]

I think losing Newnes had an obvious impact on the rebound from half back. Probably could have used a more penetrating kick like Sav today, but Bruce's absence up the ground was more noticeable than I would have liked.

[saintspremiers]

FFS
DONT REST ROO. WE HAVE A BYE THE FOLLOWING WEEK.

HOPE EVERYONE UNDERSTANDS THAT!'

[Scollop]

FFS. DOES ST KILDA EXIST SO THAT WE CAN DO WHAT'S BEST FOR ROO?

It is obvious to some of us without rose coloured glasses and to guys who are ex-footballers and doing special comments on radio and tv that Roo had problems bending and turning today. Josh Bruce was also kicking goals but he wasn't running around as a loose mid in the backline. Roo got most of his possessions down back where it's easier and no opposition player is tagging or defending against him. Basically Roo is not impacting games. Looking at the stats is pointless.

I know Roo has defied all odds in the last 2-3 years and his knees have held up despite the battering and the workload but the reality is that he's not a little bloke like Banger or Boomer. He hasn't played most of his career with a wiry frame like Tuck or Fletcher. At some point in time Roo and our supporters will have to accept that he will be replaced in the team.

Is it in the interest of the St Kilda footy club and the St Kilda team to keep Roo in the forward line as we did the in previous 2 weeks while keeping Paddy in the magoos? Why didn't we give Paddy a game against a weaker opposition like Carlton where Paddy would have got more supply and it would have been better for Paddy and better for the Saints long term.

Hopefully we win the flag this year, Roo gets the Norm Smith, and retires on a high, but what if we just miss out? Or let's say we make the 8, we go out early, and Roo has no substantial influence in the result? Can Roo realistically take the place of a youngster going forward in 2018 without a detrimental effect in 2019/2020? I mean seriously..any youngster whether they are a forward or midfielder or whatever. Why not have a fit Hickey in the team giving Longer a chop out and Hickey would also probably be pretty agile in the forward line. Is Roo doing what's best for the club in the years ahead by wanting to sign on in 2018?

[Bluthy]

Get ready for the hate Scollop. How dare you question the golden-haired boy in such a reasonable, logical way. you are a traitor. Don't you know this club is St Roolda? We won't win a single game without him for the rest of eternity apparently.

[8856brother]

Roo is playing on railway tracks atm.

Sent from my SM-T210 using Tapatalk

[BigMart]

Too slow!

Btw

Roo has been on those tracks since 2010, now he can't bend either... funny though, today his numbers were fine, I thought it was not a great game from Roo

[saintsRrising]

We got to the ball amply enough.

We were just dismal by hand and foot. That was the biggest issue today, and not just one player, but basically the whole team.

[lintonstreet]

Roo ok today - not great but far from our worse.

Yes he's coming to the end BUT he will prove a few doubters wrong after the bye

[Bluthy]

We got to the ball amply enough.

We were just dismal by hand and foot. That was the biggest issue today, and not just one player, but basically the whole team.

Its an issue of the sort of players we are developing. We haven't really put a high premium on ball use or try to use a possession based style they way other teams like Brisband and Blues seem to be doing. Hopefully it will get better as we keep getting the talented kids through but I don't think we will ever be the slick ball use team under Richo. We'll always have a bit of kamikaze style.

[skeptic]

Damn it Bluthy, you stole my post...

What I've noticed is that the coaching staff haven't figured the perfect balance for the list between contested grunts, and players that can either break lines or have sparkling disposal.

We had the balance perfect vs GWS but we lost Koby that game...

Problem number one is that we lost Webster whose is extremely valuable. His disposable helps set play up and his defensive ability helps a player like Roberton get off the leash more.

Bringing in DMac is a bad choice because he's more a grunt player w/o sublime disposable. We're already down run.
As much as I don't care for Shane Savage, he was the correct decision to bring in for Webster.

Then on the other end of the ground, we lose Bruce for Paddy... again it's not like for like. Bruce is a hard working, running, chasing, pressuring forward...
Paddy at the moment is a more stay at home type. He doesn't have the tank to replace Bruce.

When you consider the fact that Roo appears hobbled at the moment... it compounded the problem more. If Paddy came into the team, for the sake of balance, it was Riewoldt's spot he needed to take.
So we've reduced our forward defensive pressure already and our brilliant move was to then cut Minchington for Koby Stevens... now I have no issue with Koby, but like I've said countless times in the last fortnight, Mav Weller is the guy who is failing at his roles... no pressure, no goals. Weller should have gone.

And on top of it, the Koby Steven inclusion highlighted another big problem... which is that our midfield doesn't have enough outside a lot of the time.
I am strongly of the opinion that Koby, Ross and Dunstan cannot all play in the middle... as a group, they're not damaging enough...
Ross is fantastic but the difference between his ok games and his great ones is the ability to hurt the opposition with his disposals... he's getting better at it and has kicked butt the last few weeks but damage is the area of his game which isn't a natural for him. He doesn't naturally have elite disposal, he doesn't naturally break lines... it's what he is working on and needs support with

Dunstan doesn't get enough ball or hurt the opposition with his disposal... he's the one that should have made way for Koby though he made a strong a case for not being dropped last week.

Koby I think is better than Dunstan. He's more damaging and tougher but still is a bit of an unknown quantity for us. My impression is that he seems to be the more well rounded of the three... a must select for now.


If we were going to bring in so many players that lack a strong offensive side, I think you can't then have Longer in the team ahead of Hickey either... you pbly need a guy like Tom crash packs, act as a link up, takes marks around the ground etc...

We went in to today's match lacking potency... cost us big time

[BigMart]

When you're slow

You don't run with it, and in traffic, handball

Dunstan, Ross, Stevens, Steele cannot play in one team... one must go for a Jack Steven style midfielder. And we need another Jack Newnes style player, instead of Acres on the Outside. Acres should go inside.

We are strong around the footy... slow as f***

[Wayne42]

When you're slow

You don't run with it, and in traffic, handball

Dunstan, Ross, Stevens, Steele cannot play in one team... one must go for a Jack Steven style midfielder. And we need another Jack Newnes style player, instead of Acres on the Outside. Acres should go inside.

We are strong around the footy... slow as f***

Acres can't kick to position, big problem right there.

He'll never be a gun.

[Freebird]

And Dunstan can?

[BigMart]

Which is why he (Acres) should be inside... no insiders can kick really, eg/Fyfe

Outsiders have to be able to kick... they have time and space.

The other Wingman has to be a better user.

[saintsRrising]

Easy in hindsight I guess. But I didn't like McKenzie for Webster. Webster had stepped up his kicking game - still doing some clangers but much more consistent and penetrating with his kicking from the back. He gave us a much needed other foil to Joey and Robbo's run and gun from the back. Maybe Rice would have been a good selection.

Roo could use a rest. Paddy needs games but Bruce has been our hard working central target bringing the ball to ground. Without him we lacked structure.

Dunstan and Stevens maybe meant we were overloaded with slow onballers who couldn't really play anywhere else.

Gresh could use a rest and a chance to develop as a genuine midfielder. He seems to have been a bit worn down in that tough small forward role.

Yes DMak butchered the ball, but none of the above were at all crucial today. Our midfield and flankers use the ball poorly and also did not work hard enough to create options.

Also if you look at who was at Sando today iickings are thin in terms of who could have played.

Savage yes.

Rice I like because he uses the ball well and reads the play well.

DMak won the ball well today, but was dreadful with it.

I don't think Brice would have made much difference in comparison to Bruce.


Some keep raising pace. But Freeman is not yet ready, and neither is Long. Pus Wright was concussed today. Meatball certainly is not blessed with pace.

Too many of our players at present have lost their disposal mojo. Tim whenever he gets the ball, just always looks now to not want to kicked on goal and has lost his accuracy when he does. Too many players today were poor with the ball. Even sinclair was not as good as he has been recently.

Longer means that we are playing one man down as soon as the ball up has happened.

Robo is being given no space now to run into which then limits his ability to inflict damage.

Our forward strategy is 100% baffling. We keep roosting it to packs, but have no crumbers positioned. Equals easy for the opposition to clear and rebound.

We need better use of the ball and better ball users. Not sure where can get them from now? But hopefully a return in confidence will rectify many of our list.

[ace]

Too slow!

Btw

Roo has been on those tracks since 2010, now he can't bend either... funny though, today his numbers were fine, I thought it was not a great game from Roo

Yep drop Riewoldt he only got 3 goals.
We have got McCartin who got oh I forget how many goals but heaps I am sure.

[SuperDuper]

DMac showed he can get the ball today.
That had been a big question mark on him

Clearly needs to adjust to the pace and get some composure but I dont think his disposal is inherently bad.
Needs a run at it I think.. will likely improve if given the chance

[Impatient Sainter]

FFS. DOES ST KILDA EXIST SO THAT WE CAN DO WHAT'S BEST FOR ROO?

It is obvious to some of us without rose coloured glasses and to guys who are ex-footballers and doing special comments on radio and tv that Roo had problems bending and turning today. Josh Bruce was also kicking goals but he wasn't running around as a loose mid in the backline. Roo got most of his possessions down back where it's easier and no opposition player is tagging or defending against him. Basically Roo is not impacting games. Looking at the stats is pointless.

I know Roo has defied all odds in the last 2-3 years and his knees have held up despite the battering and the workload but the reality is that he's not a little bloke like Banger or Boomer. He hasn't played most of his career with a wiry frame like Tuck or Fletcher. At some point in time Roo and our supporters will have to accept that he will be replaced in the team.

Is it in the interest of the St Kilda footy club and the St Kilda team to keep Roo in the forward line as we did the in previous 2 weeks while keeping Paddy in the magoos? Why didn't we give Paddy a game against a weaker opposition like Carlton where Paddy would have got more supply and it would have been better for Paddy and better for the Saints long term.

Hopefully we win the flag this year, Roo gets the Norm Smith, and retires on a high, but what if we just miss out? Or let's say we make the 8, we go out early, and Roo has no substantial influence in the result? Can Roo realistically take the place of a youngster going forward in 2018 without a detrimental effect in 2019/2020? I mean seriously..any youngster whether they are a forward or midfielder or whatever. Why not have a fit Hickey in the team giving Longer a chop out and Hickey would also probably be pretty agile in the forward line. Is Roo doing what's best for the club in the years ahead by wanting to sign on in 2018?

Tend to agree Richo is letting Roo have too much influence at the moment and has fallen into the trap of relying on him far too heavily again. Last week it was back to Roo spraying everyone who didnt kick it to him regardless of his or his team mates positioning. Roo is a champion but Richo and his team need to grow a set and either rest him or if they insist on playing Paddy play Roo on the wing bringing Bruce back in to play forward with Paddy.

[Moods]

DMac showed he can get the ball today.
That had been a big question mark on him

Clearly needs to adjust to the pace and get some composure but I dont think his disposal is inherently bad.
Needs a run at it I think.. will likely improve if given the chance

I agree with this. DMac was disappointing today in terms of some of his clangers, however I reckon it's only fair to give a new player a minimum of 2 games to show his worth. I would playt hi, again next week. Paddy deserved his spot but was poor and I am very worried about him like many others on here. Just looks too unfit to play at this level. Will be a great VFL player but we don't recruit for Sandy. I'd also give Paddy another crack, otherwise we're better off working with Bruce.

As for Longer, I thought he was appalling today. Slow, clumsy when he did touch it (which wasn't often) and didn't have an impact today. Once again he has a few brownie points for his form this year but if Hickey is right after the bye he will be considered if Longer puts in too many games like that.

[bigcarl]

Which is why he (Acres) should be inside... no insiders can kick really, eg/Fyfe

Like Lenny. Wasn't really the greatest kick but made up for it in many other ways.

I agree with you. I have Acres as a clearance mid who can do heavy lifting but also break away from packs.

[saintsRrising]

The problem is not Roo at all.

The problem is quite simply and plainly that we do not have enough QUALITY players.

We have quite a good support cast, but we do not have enough cream. Play with even less cream, and it will just be uglier still.

Look at any of the contending teams. We have less genuine stars than any of them except perhaps the Cats who have two absolute guns in their prime in Dangerfield and Selwood.


When you have a team such as ours you need them all to be on their game, and our support cast yesterday were virtually all poor users of the ball.


PS: I am not saying that Roo should not be rested if required, but all this talk that we would be better off without him is simply crazy stuff. Tall poppy thinking.

[DownAtTheJunction]

The problem is not Roo at all.

The problem is quite simply and plainly that we do not have enough QUALITY players.

We have quite a good support cast, but we do not have enough cream. Play with even less cream, and it will just be uglier still.

Look at any of the contending teams. We have less genuine stars than any of them except perhaps the Cats who have two absolute guns in their prime in Dangerfield and Selwood.


When you have a team such as ours you need them all to be on their game, and our support cast yesterday were virtually all poor users of the ball.


PS: I am not saying that Roo should not be rested if required, but all this talk that we would be better off without him is simply crazy stuff. Tall poppy thinking.

We play our best footy when we are ballistic at the ball. Everyone has to buy in, and ‘go’ when it’s your turn. This has been the Richo brand. We have been frustratingly inconsistent this year with players choosing their level of commitment. Ultimately this leads to our opponents getting on top. We need our pressure acts to be frenetic, and from this confidence will grow.
Players do lose form. When this happens it’s doubly important to tick off the ‘one percenters’. One senses an occasional air of brashness. It was most evident with Montagna’s time-wasting goal a few weeks back. Time to get the hands dirty again, Saints … and no need to wash ‘em after a win.