Team vs. Blues

[Con Gorozidis]

I kind of like Wrighty in the side. Can force panic in the opposition backs.
Also happy to see DMac get a run.
Dunstan will do his usual game and start off like Dustin Martin and then go missing in the 2nd half as he runs out of puff and ends up a stick in the mud.

[Proph3t of egan]

Agree it was like for like structural changes.
But last week was probably Wright's best game for us and he deserved a chance to string a few together. Being dumped back to Sandy again will leave him disillusioned and sap his confidence.

The thing is that Wright isn't in demand from other AFL clubs, so I doubt he would leave the saints unless he either cops too many injuries or he is delisted

[Bernard Shakey]

Dustan showed no evidence of developing a tank at Sandy last week. Surprised to see him in.

[bigcarl]

Late change.
Out: Riewoldt (managed)
In: McCartin

Who is first emergency?

[Impatient Sainter]

Dunstan did little to deserve his recall, he showed the same lack of run in the VFL as he does when playing AFL. Richo and his team have erred dropping Wright. IMO the only change should have been Weller for Stevens and have Stevens role shared more between Weller, Minchington and Gresham.

Whats going to happen next week when Stevens returns?

[Toy Saint]

Late change.
Out: Riewoldt (managed)
In: McCartin

Who is first emergency?

Fact or speculation?

[bigcarl]

Late change.
Out: Riewoldt (managed)
In: McCartin

Who is first emergency?

Fact or speculation?

Just being mischievous. Sorry if I misled you.

[WellardSaint]

I kind of like Wrighty in the side. Can force panic in the opposition backs.
Also happy to see DMac get a run.
Dunstan will do his usual game and start off like Dustin Martin and then go missing in the 2nd half as he runs out of puff and ends up a stick in the mud.

Dunstan will ruin the midfield dynamic that was working so well.
Is Richo like Donald Trump? Stubbornly refuse to admit an error?
Hope not. Hope he will bring Koby straight back
and drop his little mate.

[WellardSaint]

Stevens and Dunstan...
Dunstan will be worried about Koby.
The worry won't increase his aerobic capacity- he physically cannot run after half-time, so he'll
struggle and fall away. We won't see much of him.

Anyone thinks his presence on the ground against Dees, WCE n Cats effectively cost us one mid,
just like having a guy on the bench?
He goes missing in a game, the midfield suffers.
He's dropped, and our mids kill Hawks, and run over Giants.
Hardly coincidence.

[Junior]

Dunstan will never be an elite runner does not have the body type for that. But I doubt he was recruited for that role anyway.

For me the issue of major concern is the fact that he seems to have gone backwards in the competitive stuff which needs to be his bread and butter.

If you can't be an outside type player , then you need to be a beast in the contest and I am seeing some real concerns there.

He of course needs to work on his running as it is not at an acceptable level but if your bread and butter stuff is missing then you are in real trouble.

Given Armo and Stevens are out I guess he was next cab of the rank for the inside type role.

Wright is stiff as I thought he did well, but Mav was always going to replace him just like I believe Stevens will replace Dunstan pending other injuries of out of this week.

[Jacks Back]

If both Armo and Stevens were ready to go and Dunstan makes way for Stevens, who makes way for Armo?

[Vazelos]

Dunstan will never be an elite runner does not have the body type for that. But I doubt he was recruited for that role anyway.

For me the issue of major concern is the fact that he seems to have gone backwards in the competitive stuff which needs to be his bread and butter.

If you can't be an outside type player , then you need to be a beast in the contest and I am seeing some real concerns there.

He of course needs to work on his running as it is not at an acceptable level but if your bread and butter stuff is missing then you are in real trouble.

Given Armo and Stevens are out I guess he was next cab of the rank for the inside type role.

Wright is stiff as I thought he did well, but Mav was always going to replace him just like I believe Stevens will replace Dunstan pending other injuries of out of this week.

What was Greg Williams' bodybtype when he used to consistently rack up 40 plus possession games?!
Can he tag and sit on an opposing champion?
Are his hands exceptional?
Can he run out games?
Is he great in clearance work?
Is he great in contested stuff?
Is he a menacing physical presence?
Yes he had some pedigree as a junior but not sure where the upside will come from?
I know he has some improvement in him I just hope it's enough.

[Joe Bloggs]

If both Armo and Stevens were ready to go and Dunstan makes way for Stevens, who makes way for Armo?

Good question.. both leave big hearts but lack pace. Neither in our best 22 at the moment. Imo

[saintspremiers]

If both Armo and Stevens were ready to go and Dunstan makes way for Stevens, who makes way for Armo?

Good question.. both leave big hearts but lack pace. Neither in our best 22 at the moment. Imo

You joking?

Armo is definitely in our best 22. He's a grunt machine that goes all day.

Koby is also definitely in our best 22.

Out: Dunny & Meatball (based on current form)

In: Stevens & Armo (when fit)

[skeptic]

I would have preferred Weller to have to force his way in...
Other than the Hawthorn game he's been way down so far this season and is currently pbly the worst shot for goal in our team.

I thought Wright did okay last week.

Dunstan for Stevens just seems like a no win situation. He has to make a move Luke. Remind everyone he can play.

[jays]

like for like but next week i expect to see koby back in

[saintsRrising]

I would have preferred Weller to have to force his way in...
Other than the Hawthorn game he's been way down so far this season and is currently pbly the worst shot for goal in our team.

.

By way down, you can't mean statistically. So you are meaning in execution I assume?

Yes there were a couple of easy goals he missed, but apart from that his numbers stack up.

His least number of disposal is 14.

Minche's best is 17.
Wright's best is 12
Lonie's is 16




I agree that Wright is stiff. But Weller's record is good, including this year.

[Johnny Member]

A bit tough on Wrighty. Roo must be up and about, because I'd have thought Carlton was the perfect week for a little rest if needed ...

I just dont think Wright is any good.

[skeptic]

I would have preferred Weller to have to force his way in...
Other than the Hawthorn game he's been way down so far this season and is currently pbly the worst shot for goal in our team.

.

By way down, you can't mean statistically. So you are meaning in execution I assume?

Yes there were a couple of easy goals he missed, but apart from that his numbers stack up.

His least number of disposal is 14.

Minche's best is 17.
Wright's best is 12
Lonie's is 16




I agree that Wright is stiff. But Weller's record is good, including this year.

I think many ppl easily forget... this forum was filthy on MAV after Melb and WCE.. he was ok the next few games and great like everyone vs Haw.

I like the kid and am happy to see him continue but I don't like different rules for different ppl

[saintsRrising]

I think many ppl easily forget... this forum was filthy on MAV after Melb and WCE.. he was ok the next few games and great like everyone vs Haw.

I like the kid and am happy to see him continue but I don't like different rules for different ppl

I agree that Wellers first 2 games were not his best. Though against the Dees there were bigger villians and you could have dropped half the team, and if you believe Weller's Dees game was bad, Wright was clearly worse with 8 disposals and only the one tackle. So if that game was a reason to not bring Weller back, it was a bigger reason to drop Wright.

Weller's form has built and his game against the Hawks was superb. So with respect to Weller I am not sure why the different rules apply. Which rule do you mean?

Weller is also a better marking target than the other small forwards.


However again I 100% agree that Wright was stiff to be left out. With a deeper list now many players are going to be stiff.

[stonecold]

Lukey Dunstan is the new Sam Gilbert, while according to some experts here anyway!!!!!!

Devo is back, just a different name and number, the blokes who count are backing him, so good enough for me!!!!!

[skeptic]

I think many ppl easily forget... this forum was filthy on MAV after Melb and WCE.. he was ok the next few games and great like everyone vs Haw.

I like the kid and am happy to see him continue but I don't like different rules for different ppl

I agree that Wellers first 2 games were not his best. Though against the Dees there were bigger villians and you could have dropped half the team, and if you believe Weller's Dees game was bad, Wright was clearly worse with 8 disposals and only the one tackle. So if that game was a reason to not bring Weller back, it was a bigger reason to drop Wright.

Weller's form has built and his game against the Hawks was superb. So with respect to Weller I am not sure why the different rules apply. Which rule do you mean?

Weller is also a better marking target than the other small forwards.


However again I 100% agree that Wright was stiff to be left out. With a deeper list now many players are going to be stiff.

I don't think I'm being very difficult to understand...
Players, especially the more established ones like those in the leadership group, should play to the standard expected of them.

On form, Weller has been well done on the very high standard he set last year and I don't view his performance in a 15 goal demolition of an under performing club a huge mark of redemption.

I have nothing against the kid but based on his form this season, he should have (IMO) been made to force his way back into the team. He shouldn't get a free pass when a player like Wright does his job and gets dumped despite it.

That being said, I'm not overly bothered by it because I really rate Weller... one of my favs. I feel for Wright too. Just reiterating that ppl should earn their spots and the reality is we have different expectations on different players.

[saintsRrising]

Though I think the club has tried out all the small forwards this season.

Long, Minch, Wright, Gresh (who while he probably will become a mid when his aerobic capacity increases) and Lonie have all been played. As has Weller.

Even Billings has had games like last week where he was played forward, and Billings form in hat role will probably see him stay forward for now, and that in turn has helped to squeeze out Wright.

IMO I do not think that any of them has on average played better than Weller this year, and indeed I would believe that Weller has still been the best of them. Though Gresh has had the nice habit of icing some snap goals.

If Weller had been worse then it would be different, but in my view his form has been better. That for me is why he is back in rather than being a favourite.


So I guess where we can agree to disagree is on the overall form showed by Weller this season.

[SuperDuper]

Though I think the club has tried out all the small forwards this season.

Long, Minch, Wright, Gresh (who while he probably will become a mid when his aerobic capacity increases) and Lonie have all been played. As has Weller.

Even Billings has had games like last week where he was played forward, and Billings form in hat role will probably see him stay forward for now, and that in turn has helped to squeeze out Wright.

IMO I do not think that any of them has on average played better than Weller this year, and indeed I would believe that Weller has still been the best of them. Though Gresh has had the nice habit of icing some snap goals.

If Weller had been worse then it would be different, but in my view his form has been better. That for me is why he is back in rather than being a favourite.


So I guess where we can agree to disagree is on the overall form showed by Weller this season.

I agree. Weller missed a few goals he should have got.. and normally gets.. and that the coaches would back him to get .. but otherthan that his overall form has been pretty well similar to what we expect of him. His averages in most stats including kicks handballs marks and goals are higher than last year

[Scollop]

A bit tough on Wrighty. Roo must be up and about, because I'd have thought Carlton was the perfect week for a little rest if needed ...

If roo was to be rested....it would have been last week...looked sore/tired after double six day break.....should be fresher this week!!

He's a champ's champ. Still valuable the last 2 weeks even though not looking 100%. Never thought we would rest him against the Giants, but looking forward to seeing how he goes this week.

There are no "easy" games for quite a few weeks, although I'd like to see us revisit our recent form at smashijng the Blues.

I'm just stoked we get to have a debate over replacing good players with other good players. In my lifetime we've never had actual depth, what a bloody relief the last few years of recruiting have delivered us.

I would have liked Roo to be rested this week and next week. Play him against the Dogs. He then gets a 2 week rest again with the bye. I would have thought that if we are going to be serious contenders then Roo needs to be properly managed and rested throughout the year - not just for a week or two at the pointy end.

Our defense is one of the best at the moment imo. Robbo and Webster get the benefit of the shut down defenders and along with our ever improving midfield the team is gaining confidence as a unit. Our forwards are working well together and getting good supply and much better delivery than the last few years. All in all, the development of the team is proving we don't rely on Roo and Joey being in the best players each week. In fact, we are not relying on Roo being a matchwinner in 2017

I know Roo has defied all odds in the last 2-3 years and his knees have held up despite the battering and the workload but the reality is that he's not a little bloke like Banger or Boomer. He hasn't played most of his career with a wiry frame like Tuck or Fletcher. At some point in time he has to accept that he is replaceable in the team. The coach cannot allow Roo to continue playing indefinitely if he is hobbling and inneffective. To make the job easier for the committee and coach and for the footy department to have the retirement conversation with Roo, I have no doubt that was the main reason he was asked to relinquish the captaincy.

I believe Richo is doing the right thing by keeping Paddy in the magoos. Paddy needs some hard lessons and he needs to lift his workload to earn a recall. The management of Paddy although is a seperate issue, it is now being suggested in media circles that perhaps Roo playing on in 2018 could be affecting Paddy's development. It also seems to me that with the injury Roo suffered in round 1, perhaps he is not as agile as last year and can't play up the ground as much as he did last year.

Is it in the interest of the St Kilda footy club and the St Kilda team to keep Roo in the forward line instead of Paddy? Hopefully we win the flag this year, Roo gets the Norm Smith, and retires on a high, but what if we make the 8, we go out early, and Roo has no substantial influence in the result? Can Roo realistically take the place of a youngster going forward in 2018 without a detrimental effect in 2019/2020. Is he doing what's best for the club in the years ahead by wanting to sign on in 2018.