How many time how many excuses???

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Teflon
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How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663014Post Teflon »

Let's face facts

Game in balance with ball in hand we lacked class Cats didn't
In 09 GF game in balance we lack class - Cats don't
When will we face facts that carrying unskillful players by foot will only lead you to heartbreak when the heat is on???

Midfield A Class is not there. In the last Qtr they stepped up- we wilted.

Until we address this we are a good middle of the road side relying on ageing stars.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663020Post CURLY »

Teflon wrote:Let's face facts

Game in balance with ball in hand we lacked class Cats didn't
In 09 GF game in balance we lack class - Cats don't
When will we face facts that carrying unskillful players by foot will only lead you to heartbreak when the heat is on???

Midfield A Class is not there. In the last Qtr they stepped up- we wilted.

Until we address this we are a good middle of the road side relying on ageing stars.
Geelong only just bought the best mid fielder in the AFL and a host of other 25+ year old best 22. Let's see what we do then.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663021Post BigMart »

This was a huge game

Disappointing result, we lack run and polish...

And this pressure game plan... just hurts the legs


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663028Post Hemi Baxter »

Yes we lacked class. Yes we couldn't stop Selwood. There is however no excuse for most of the side knocking up as if shot after three quarters of football.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663032Post Johnny Member »

??

Who do we bring in??


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663042Post Con Gorozidis »

Dunstan has played 58 AFL games.
0 VFL games.

His running ability is nowhere near AFL level. His last quarters are embarrassing. He looks like he is running in quick sand. Stuck in mud.
Can't see how he is going to make it unless there is some dramatic change in this.

Surely the love affair with him and the coach is coming to an end?


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663046Post Bruce G McAbee »

We also need a better solution to having Bruce going into the ruck.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663047Post shrodes »

Bruce G McAbee wrote:We also need a better solution to having Bruce going into the ruck.
Agree. I think his best ruck contest was one where he didn't even bother going up for it.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663060Post Bluthy »

Yep agree with a lot of the comments here about lack of class and also the game plan. When teams put the full court press back on us, our skills and decision making can look deplorable. Plus our high pressure, high labour game plan means we fall in a hole from exhaustion. It might get a bit better as the young players get better tanks.

But whether we keep pumping games into the money ball types of Weller, Bruce, Savage, Brown, Members (who does have a bit of class), Roberton - and guys like Webster, Geary (as captain isn't going anywhere) Gilbo etc. Or whether we target the younger players who have shown some class ball use and genuine AFL weaponry - White, Rice, Sincs, Marshall, Battle, Mckenzie.

Our inability to keep the ball as another weapon to control momentum is a big issue. Geelong used it to devastating advantage in the second half - taking the pace out of the game until they were ready to push forward. At the moment for us, its all pressure or nothing. We need another dimension to our game.


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White Winmar
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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663066Post White Winmar »

Johnny Member wrote:??

Who do we bring in??
An expert on endurance, JM. We've been cooked at 3/4 time too many times this season. Either the game style is unsustainable, or the players aren't fit enough. Wait a minute, that's a bit of a tautology. Aren't they the same thing?


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663199Post Enrico_Misso »

We had 6 months to get some endurance fitness, yet we died at 3/4 time and just wilted.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663204Post suss »

It's a bit all doom and gloom on here but if you add Kelly and / or Fyfe to that team, who wins?

We are still 1-2 years away and need some class to take it to the next level ...


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663226Post samuraisaint »

I was up on level 3 behind the goals at the Geelong cheer squad end. I had a bird's eye view all afternoon of us winning the ball in general play, one of our players, usually Steven I think, bolting away from Geelong players, only to run towards a forward line, look up and see no St. Kilda players in it whatsoever. I don't know how often this happened. The work Minchington was doing off the ball was phenomenal. He and Roberton were amongst our best today.
At one stage every player on the field was in one quarter of the ground (Geelong's forward pocket). Every single player. I don't profess to be an expert on tactics or structure but we should keep at least our book ends at FB and FF.
I think it is now obvious that our run and manic pressure game is exhausting the players so that by the last quarter there is nothing left in the tank. It could be that the players are at the tail end of recovering form extra loading in their pre-season training, so if so, we should see an improvement in our ability to finish off games from now on.
We desperately need to find another tall, quick midfielder, with elite finishing skills by hand and foot, perhaps two. The best tall mid available with our first draft pick and a free agent midfielder with the second should do it.
I am not going to say much about the ruck situation except that Hickey is our #1 ruckman, but we can use Longer to give Hickey a chop out. It is better if Bruce can stay in the forward line.
Yes, Geelong have picked up players in Dangerfield, Henderson, Tuohy and Smith, but we have picked up Carlisle and Brown, as well as Stevens and Steele, so there is no excuse for the fade out in the last quarter. Geelong have just done a great job in developing their players. I heard on the radio that this is the fifth out of six years where Geelong have won their first five games or better. Like the Melbourne loss, I think we have to acknowledge that they were just the better side on the day.
I didn't think we'd play finals this year anyway, and always expected that this season would be a treading water year where we get games and experience into players, and at least it is obvious that the endeavour is certainly there.
Today was a 50/50 and we lost, but we must win next week. There could be as many as four changes next week.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663231Post Sainternist »

Hemi Baxter wrote:Yes we couldn't stop Selwood.
But we didn't even try to stop Selwood. No one even knows who played on him. Did he even have an opponent? Richo should be held accountable for that. That is a major coaching brainfade. 43 possessions - what a joke!!!


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663236Post WellardSaint »

Sainternist wrote:
Hemi Baxter wrote:Yes we couldn't stop Selwood.
But we didn't even try to stop Selwood. No one even knows who played on him. Did he even have an opponent? Richo should be held accountable for that. That is a major coaching brainfade. 43 possessions - what a joke!!!
Richo said after the game, that at 3qtr time, they knew how much Duckwood had, but they were happy with not tagging him as we were still in touch...maybe he just wanted our mids to run free and not tag, you know, take the game on.
Richo- how long have you been in this coaching caper? :shock: :evil:

And they give Ross the "Sainter of the Day" award because he got 33 or so.
This is like the Under 11's where everyone gets an award for just turning up.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663237Post Impatient Sainter »

Richo's high press/pressure game plan is not sustainable with our current list against the better sides.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663334Post Long Term Injury »

Bluthy wrote:Yep agree with a lot of the comments here about lack of class and also the game plan. When teams put the full court press back on us, our skills and decision making can look deplorable. Plus our high pressure, high labour game plan means we fall in a hole from exhaustion. It might get a bit better as the young players get better tanks.

But whether we keep pumping games into the money ball types of Weller, Bruce, Savage, Brown, Members (who does have a bit of class), Roberton - and guys like Webster, Geary (as captain isn't going anywhere) Gilbo etc. Or whether we target the younger players who have shown some class ball use and genuine AFL weaponry - White, Rice, Sincs, Marshall, Battle, Mckenzie.

Our inability to keep the ball as another weapon to control momentum is a big issue. Geelong used it to devastating advantage in the second half - taking the pace out of the game until they were ready to push forward. At the moment for us, its all pressure or nothing. We need another dimension to our game.
Don't necessarily disagree but where are we lacking that class, generally it is in the midfield where we are quite young. I think the result was a promising one for us in the sense that the cats were throwing everything at us in the last half and we survived for a good 35 of the 60 minutes. We did handle the pressure for the first three quarters. This is progress. Of course disappointed with the result , but the fact that we didn't really have dominant players against a premiership contender and went at it for as long as we did is really encouraging.

I'm finding that I have to change the way I watch footy. The last couple of years I've been looking for young players having standout games , showing bits of class that give us hope going forward. I think now I'm seeing a really even contribution from a young midfield with no standouts, I think this is really good news. Yes there is room for improvement, without doubt, but I think thestory is a positive one. This time next year when we are more battle hardened we will be able to go the distance... I think it bodes well. We are going to get as good as we give in terms of pressure this year, and we will be better for it in the long run. I'd almost prefer tonight's result than continuing to rely on selwood or danger field to get us over he line.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663335Post citywest »

Teflon wrote:Let's face facts

Game in balance with ball in hand we lacked class Cats didn't
In 09 GF game in balance we lack class - Cats don't
When will we face facts that carrying unskillful players by foot will only lead you to heartbreak when the heat is on???

Midfield A Class is not there. In the last Qtr they stepped up- we wilted.

Until we address this we are a good middle of the road side relying on ageing stars.
Are you for f****** real? I was proud of how our team played. We ran out of gas in the last quarter against a top 4 team. There is no disgrace in that.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663341Post Teflon »

citywest wrote:
Teflon wrote:Let's face facts

Game in balance with ball in hand we lacked class Cats didn't
In 09 GF game in balance we lack class - Cats don't
When will we face facts that carrying unskillful players by foot will only lead you to heartbreak when the heat is on???

Midfield A Class is not there. In the last Qtr they stepped up- we wilted.

Until we address this we are a good middle of the road side relying on ageing stars.
Are you for f****** real? I was proud of how our team played. We ran out of gas in the last quarter against a top 4 team. There is no disgrace in that.
Good for you - I'm interested in what and how we become genuine contenders not just "we kept up with the Cats (who we beat last year) for 3 quarters.... so proud!!!"

To not fire a shot like we did in the last Qtr is disappointing - sugar coat it all you like, we lacked class with the ball in hand under pressure an in the end turned it over more than them.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663379Post desertsaint »

WellardSaint wrote:
Sainternist wrote:
Hemi Baxter wrote:Yes we couldn't stop Selwood.
But we didn't even try to stop Selwood. No one even knows who played on him. Did he even have an opponent? Richo should be held accountable for that. That is a major coaching brainfade. 43 possessions - what a joke!!!
Richo said after the game, that at 3qtr time, they knew how much Duckwood had, but they were happy with not tagging him as we were still in touch...maybe he just wanted our mids to run free and not tag, you know, take the game on.
Richo- how long have you been in this coaching caper? :shock: :evil:

And they give Ross the "Sainter of the Day" award because he got 33 or so.
This is like the Under 11's where everyone gets an award for just turning up.
From what i saw and richardson said - dunstan ran with danger until the last when scott moved him forward. ross went to selwood in the last.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663402Post thejiggingsaint »

When the frustration and pain of the loss subsides; when one can take a long and deep breath and consider the game objectively, I'm reasonably pleased with many aspects of our development. Anyone who thinks that this rebuild will yield immediate success (IMHO) is being unrealistic. There ARE plenty of reasons to feel happy and good about where we are at as a club. We have a clear choice: Get behind the club and its coaches 100% OR sit in our own schitt and wallow in maintaining our "victim status" I know where I stand!


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663405Post samoht »

We need leg speed and good disposal -- and yet we have Savage, McKenzie, White and Rice playing in the twos?
Not one of these players was considered ahead of an unproven Long?
Seriously?

For those who see Savage as being "soft" ... you didn't see the courageous mark he took in the Sandringham game on the weekend.
He knew what was coming and didn't flinch - waited seconds for a skyed ball to drop into his arms - before being severely crunched by two Richmond players - front and back. It was painful just watching it unfold.
Providing valuable outside run doesn't mean you're soft.

Selectors - get it (the balance) right!


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663428Post Joffa Burns »

IMO we need the following to be a contender...

1 X Half back with pace and good foot skills
1 X A grade mid with good foot skills
1 X B grade mid with real leg speed
1 X key forward or key back moving Carliske forward

Hopefully Paddy is the key forward or Goddard the key back.
We have the chance to bring the others into the club with two top ten picks and free agency at end of year.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663437Post White Winmar »

Bruce G McAbee wrote:We also need a better solution to having Bruce going into the ruck.
This. He's a liability in the ruck and we get thrashed every time he goes in there.


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Re: How many time how many excuses???

Post: # 1663469Post Saintmatt »

Teflon wrote:Let's face facts

Game in balance with ball in hand we lacked class Cats didn't
In 09 GF game in balance we lack class - Cats don't
When will we face facts that carrying unskillful players by foot will only lead you to heartbreak when the heat is on???

Midfield A Class is not there. In the last Qtr they stepped up- we wilted.

Until we address this we are a good middle of the road side relying on ageing stars.
Correct. When you have Gilbert & Geary turning it over backwards of centre - you have very little hope. When Roberton streams off half back after another great intercept mark but then kicks it out on the full or to the opposition - it kills us. When Webster can't execute a basic 20m pass and stubbs it to the opposition a the top of the goalsquare - you're really just kidding yourself.

The very good teams that compete well and often don't have those poor disposers by foot (or if they do - not that many of them). To be honest - it was somewhat of a miracle that we were in front at 3/4 time given how well we self-sabotage our own gameplan.

Until we address the massive holes in our midfield - we're just treading water. As if the current side - playing as well as it is - would make a top 8 side quiver in fear at present. We have zero weapons apart from Jack Steven (pretty easy to sit on one mid alone) and maybe Roo. The rest are largely just GOPs.


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