We need to talk about Paddy.

[saynta]

I agree if you all love Bont and Petracca so much then go and fin support the Bulldogs and Dees and do us all a favor

Gold mate.

[longtimesaint]

I haven't seen anything yet to suggest that Petracca will be better than Paddy in the long run.
This looking at past draft choices in hindsight is a waste of everyones time.

[Leo.J]

At the end of the day regardless of how good Roo is/was he couldn't deliver us a flag.

Only a handful of premierships in the last 25 years have been won by teams whose best players are key forwards.

Paddy is only one part of the puzzle.

[skeptic]

Wasn't one of the knocks of Petracca that he was training at a higher standard than most players his age (he had a high class trainer or something) with the thought being that he was a lot closer to his ceiling than others.

I think there were knocks on his attitude?

[Zed]

Hidden in this thread are actually a couple of good talking points.

1. Big Mart - the Paddy comparison to Tex and Roughy.I remember the Roughy comparison being made on draft day - but really cant see it. Can anyone ?. Tex, maybe - probably more so from an attitude perspective though - I reckon in time to come the boys will gravitate toward him much the same way the Crows boys did prior to Tex being a leader. Personally, I've always thought Kennedy from WC is the player most similar to Paddy. I'd love to get some footage of a young Kennedy and compare.

2. Sainter_ Dad. I think you're right - most drafts contain at least 1 gun midfielder, and there are plenty of examples of gun mids going in the top 10 and beyond. But gun junior key forwards aren't typically available beyond the first few picks - and certainly not in every draft. I think we took the option of taking a power forward rated as a top 2 draft pick when we had the chance on the assumption that we may not get access to a top 2 pick the following year, but still have access to a low enough pick to get a good mid.

[BigMart]

Devilhead

Is that a serious response??

Who said anyone Loves Bont or Petracca

Just able to acknowledge they are quality players and will be better than the players we selected prior to them

Having a hissy fit over someone's footy pov is a bit much

[st.byron]

I agree if you all love Bont and Petracca so much then go and fin support the Bulldogs and Dees and do us all a favor

Not about supporting another team.

Looks at this point, that in the last few years we've taken options with top 5 draft picks that were not the best choices. Daniel instead of Lonie would also have been a better option. Easy to cherry pick recruiting and compare specific players to make the recruiting look bad - and it's easy in hindsight - but the fact appears to be that Bont, Petracca and Daniel would have been better options than the one's we chose. Significantly better. It's not even a criticism of our recruiters, it's easy in hindsight. Just a shame we didn't make the most of our top end picks. I hope BIllings and Paddy prove me totally wrong.

[Scollop]

Saints traditionally go for Anglo Saxons and have not tended to favour Italions

Please don't respond as if I am making a serious point...it's just a tongue in cheek smartalec comment

[BadRossco]

I believe the answer to Zeds question regarding two top 10 picks will be that our recruiters will trade both. After well deserved criticism for picking Billings and Paddy they seem hell bent on avoiding the draft.

[Devilhead]

Devilhead

Is that a serious response??

Who said anyone Loves Bont or Petracca

Just able to acknowledge they are quality players and will be better than the players we selected prior to them

Having a hissy fit over someone's footy pov is a bit much

Haha hissy fit - ok then - better than creaming my pants over opposition players and getting hung up on our drafting.

It's been going for two years - multiple threads comparing Billings to Bont and Paddy to Petracca and forumites bemoaning our draft selections

Seriously it's time to move on.

[BigMart]

So we can't discuss it??

Here's some more hilarity from early DPs

2-Ball
3-Judd

5-Clarke
7-Bartel

9-Armitage
12/13-Frawley or Riewoldt

9-McEvoy
10-Dangerfield

3-Billings
4- Bontempelli

1-McCartin
2-Petracca

Get one of those right we have multiple flags

Actually too early on 2014... but the others, yep

[Devilhead]

Fine keep living in the past - I prefer to look forward thanks

[White Winmar]

[quote="Zed"]WW - so in your opinion should we have picked Petracca over Paddy ?

Also, let's say for arguments sake we end up with 2 top 10 draft picks this year. Do we look to keep them both, trade 1 and keep 1 , or trade them both ?[/quote]
A really difficult one, Zed. So many pros and cons. If it had been a few years earlier, say 2010, when Roo had another 7-8 years in him, then I would've taken Petracca. IMHO, he's the more talented player. He will be a star. He would've suited our needs better then. Paddy suits our needs a little better now. Most expected Roo to be done by the end of 2016, when we picked Paddy. Who would've been able to tell Roo would keep going at his incredible standard? He will play on in 2018 if his body allows him. On the plus side, Paddy has more improvement in him. As a tall forward he will take longer. They mostly do, with Roo being a rare exception.

Paddy is also very mature for his age. He's determined, focused, a future leader and a good bloke by all accounts. Christian can be hard work, I'm told and interviewed poorly with us at the draft. Either one would've been the "right" choice. We were forced into a decision and made it. If his health doesn't let him down, he'll be top shelf. As Chairman Mao said in 1967, when asked if the French Revolution worked, "It's still too early to tell."

[saintsRrising]

So we can't discuss it??

Here's some more hilarity from early DPs

2-Ball
3-Judd

5-Clarke
7-Bartel

9-Armitage
12/13-Frawley or Riewoldt

9-McEvoy
10-Dangerfield

3-Billings
4- Bontempelli

1-McCartin
2-Petracca

Get one of those right we have multiple flags

Actually too early on 2014... but the others, yep

I can supply last weeks winning Tatts Numbers too.

The above list is pretty meaningless as PRIOR to the names being called out most were pretty much reasonable picks for where they were taken based on the info available prior to each draft.

Judd the club tried to be too cleaver on by predicting who another club would pick. So for my mind that is the only genuine real stuff up.

Yes Bont is better than Billings. But at the time most pundits would have had Billings rated higher.

With Petracca and Paddy. Whole probably more had Petracca higher, many also had Paddy No1. Personally I favoured getting Petracca, but I was not aghast at getting Paddy.

PS: If Xavier had not been crueled by injury he would have been an even better player for us than he was.

[White Winmar]

Jimmy Bartel would've been good. Xav was an exceptional talent who simply didn't have the body for AFL. Pity. He was a gun.

[DJ Higgins]

From memory at the time we picked Paddy most pundits were claiming him as the #1 pick. A genuine forward with skills and a replacement for Roo. Not a new Roo but a forward for when he retires. I can't remember if we had Josh Bruce then and don't forget we got him as a back, not a forward so we got lucky there especially after Spencer White failed. And I think Skunk wasn't that good then either. In other words we had a huge need for a forward. Petracca and Brayshaw looked really good as well but we needed a forward more.

And give him time to get good. He is a key forward FFS. They are not mids who can play straight away, They have to grow up and out, have to get fitter and learn how to play with giants marking them.

[ace]

From memory at the time we picked Paddy most pundits were claiming him as the #1 pick. A genuine forward with skills and a replacement for Roo. Not a new Roo but a forward for when he retires. I can't remember if we had Josh Bruce then and don't forget we got him as a back, not a forward so we got lucky there especially after Spencer White failed. And I think Skunk wasn't that good then either. In other words we had a huge need for a forward. Petracca and Brayshaw looked really good as well but we needed a forward more.

And give him time to get good. He is a key forward FFS. They are not mids who can play straight away, They have to grow up and out, have to get fitter and learn how to play with giants marking them.

How do you get elite fit with type 1 diabetes?

[White Winmar]

From memory at the time we picked Paddy most pundits were claiming him as the #1 pick. A genuine forward with skills and a replacement for Roo. Not a new Roo but a forward for when he retires. I can't remember if we had Josh Bruce then and don't forget we got him as a back, not a forward so we got lucky there especially after Spencer White failed. And I think Skunk wasn't that good then either. In other words we had a huge need for a forward. Petracca and Brayshaw looked really good as well but we needed a forward more.

And give him time to get good. He is a key forward FFS. They are not mids who can play straight away, They have to grow up and out, have to get fitter and learn how to play with giants marking them.

How do you get elite fit with type 1 diabetes?

You have a very good point there, chumbly, bumbly. If not elite fitness, recovery from injury is a huge issue, well documented over decades.

[Sainternist]

After reading the posts in this thread, I could use a good Prozac milkshake.

[saintspremiers]

Shame we stuffed up picking Dal with pick 13, Joey about pick 30. And Gilbo and Fish in the 30's to 50's range

[White Winmar]

Shame we stuffed up picking Dal with pick 13, Joey about pick 30. And Gilbo and Fish in the 30's to 50's range

That's the wonderful world of recruiting, SP. The recruiting gods giveth and taketh away. Every club has its recruiting horror stories and missed opportunities. Ours get thrown into sharp relief because we've won one flag in 120 years. Flags buy forgiveness, as Yabby would tell us.

[DJ Higgins]

From memory at the time we picked Paddy most pundits were claiming him as the #1 pick. A genuine forward with skills and a replacement for Roo. Not a new Roo but a forward for when he retires. I can't remember if we had Josh Bruce then and don't forget we got him as a back, not a forward so we got lucky there especially after Spencer White failed. And I think Skunk wasn't that good then either. In other words we had a huge need for a forward. Petracca and Brayshaw looked really good as well but we needed a forward more.

And give him time to get good. He is a key forward FFS. They are not mids who can play straight away, They have to grow up and out, have to get fitter and learn how to play with giants marking them.

How do you get elite fit with type 1 diabetes?

You have a very good point there, chumbly, bumbly. If not elite fitness, recovery from injury is a huge issue, well documented over decades.

Not claiming to be an expert or a doctor but I am assuming our selection committee would have done their due diligence and research. You can google famous athletes with type 1 diabetes from all kinds of professional sports including endurance sports and contact sports so I doubt he uses his diabetes as an excuse. Also slow healing from diabetes is a bit of myth. High blood glucose may slow the healing process but if you go to a doctor they will give you a shot to drop your BG level and you will heal like everyone else. Time will tell but I have seen enough to see he could be great but probably not elite. His marking is getting better, crashing packs more often and getting more confident. He probably wont be elite but very few are.

[White Winmar]

Slow healing due to diabetes is one of the major downsides of the condition. Blood glucose level control helps, but no amount of insulin brings you to normal rates of healing. It's a fact and one Paddy lives with every day. He can manage it, al a Dale Weightman, but each diabetic is different and Oaddy does have a disadvantage.

[Stephen Theodore]

After 51 years, my patience is wearing a bit thin mate.

With you Saynta, after nearly 60 years my patience is also starting to thin out

[Linton Lodger]

So we can't discuss it??

Here's some more hilarity from early DPs

2-Ball
3-Judd

5-Clarke
7-Bartel

9-Armitage
12/13-Frawley or Riewoldt

9-McEvoy
10-Dangerfield

3-Billings
4- Bontempelli

1-McCartin
2-Petracca

Get one of those right we have multiple flags

Actually too early on 2014... but the others, yep

Ouch! On the first four. I think you've gone early on the last two.

Bont was physically ready to play from the get go, as was Riewoldt back then. Petracca is going to be a gun, but he is not and I don't think ever will be Lenny Hayes. When you invest Pick 1 in a mid, you'd expect a Lenny, Harvey, Dangerfield or Ablett [jnr].