Petracca v McCartin

[White Winmar]

Petracca and Paddy will both be guns. Tough choice at the draft. A bit like choosing whether to date Jennifer Hawkins or Megan Gale. Or Loris.

[loris]

Petracca and Paddy will both be guns. Tough choice at the draft. A bit like choosing whether to date Jennifer Hawkins or Megan Gale. Or Loris.

I'm free this sat night after the Eagles game WW Wellard Saint has stood me up

[Dave McNamara]

Or taken either Frawley or J.Riewoldt over Armo

Or Danger or Rioli over McEvoy

Correct. But, with hindsight.

However, at the time(s) it was understandable, as we needed on-ballers - in Armo's case. (Seems we still may.) And we desperately needed a ruckman re Big Ben. (At least we got an excellent trade deal for Ben.)

2008 we actually got it right (for once) but didn't give Lynch a game.

Unfortunately, Tom Lynch was cooked at St Kilda once Pluggsy wrote him off.

If Tom Boyd even remotely came into our thinking, we are a basket case.

Agree. The most overrated eight possie' game in VFL/AFL history! And no tackles laid. No spillages created...

For perspective:
The bloke was such a great forward... they had to play him as a mediocre ruckman. (Fortunately, against other mediocre ruckmen.)
Recruiting Tragic Joke says it all, as to what the Poodles really think of Boyd's abilities.

More perspective:
Carey,
Roo,
Franklin,
Judd,
Gablett jnr,
Dangerfield (ok, he actually took a cut to got home to Hillbilly town),
Fyffe,
Martin...
that's the sort of output $1 mil a season is meant to buy you.

[takeaway]

My only concern with McCartin is keeping him on the park. I have no doubt he was the right choice & he will be a gun forward, and has shown plenty already.
One gun forward is worth 2 top midfielders - and midfielders are much easier to recruit/poach.

[BigMart]

We recruited Ben because we needed a ruckman?

We recruited Armo because we needed mids

Are you sure?

For a start, you don't recruit for immediate needs, especially talls... wtf is an 18yo ruckman going to do for 4 years

Mids in 2006
We had 3 AA mids in 2005
Hayes, Harvey, Dal, Ball, BJ

We had We had Fraser 30 and Hamill injured and done - Forward
We had Hudghton 30 and Penny gone - Back

But reality is, you recruit a player for 10 years not a couple
You trade for needs

That why best available is the only consideration

[skeptic]

We recruited Ben because we needed a ruckman?

We recruited Armo because we needed mids

Are you sure?

For a start, you don't recruit for immediate needs, especially talls... wtf is an 18yo ruckman going to do for 4 years

Mids in 2006
We had 3 AA mids in 2005
Hayes, Harvey, Dal, Ball, BJ

We had We had Fraser 30 and Hamill injured and done - Forward
We had Hudghton 30 and Penny gone - Back

But reality is, you recruit a player for 10 years not a couple
You trade for needs

That why best available is the only consideration

Our recruiting was so bad over that era... there's every chance that we genuinely believed they were the best players?

[degruch]

We recruited Ben because we needed a ruckman?

We recruited Armo because we needed mids

Are you sure?

For a start, you don't recruit for immediate needs, especially talls... wtf is an 18yo ruckman going to do for 4 years

Wait for Kingy and Gardy to retire...pretty astute pickup, of course.

Armo over J Riewoldt? Line ball. I'm sure there's plenty other closer wild speculations we could call on.

[BigMart]

King stated in 2008

A year after Ben was recruited,

we took Gardiner earlier but he was a long term prospect as he came with a long term injury
He played only a handful of games in his second year after none first year (1 vfl)

We also had Clarke, Rix and any other average 200cm cast off we could get our hands on

The pick after McEvoy was the interesting one?

Jack Riewoldt being overlooked because he was seen as more of a inbetweener and not a KPP and not athletic enough
Was such a ridiculous notion it was laughable
For a start he is 6'4"
He was (and is) a terrific contested mark, extremely powerful and has clearly demonstrated he was a good footballer

In fact
When Hawthorn interviewed Hamish Ogilvie about Mitch Thorpe (who they took)
He told them they were looking at the wrong Tasmanian and the Jack was clearly a better player

They weren't a fan of Jacks (Richo body language)
Irony being, it turned out Thorpe had some attitude issues while there

Ogilvie even insisted that Jacks body language was such because of over caring

It was a classic case of trying to find reasons not to recruit someone, and missing th obvious.

John Bevridge is a nice man, but really he made some massive stuff ups

I mean how we let Brad Green (highly rated) in 1999 slip past us, to take Caydn? But he was not at all keen Green, but was interested in Rob Murphy (even bigger ouch) it was believed we wanted a Harvey replacement.

Issues with that
He played another 9 seasons for one
And
There would never be a Harvey replacement

JB also had issues with inbetweeners at one point
Then recruited heaps From 02-08
Goddard, Ferguson, R Clarke, Gilbert, Lynch, Heyne

Then there was the
Gippsland thing
The
Queensland thing

[The Fireman]

Lovin the Bont

[degruch]

If Tom Boyd even remotely came into our thinking, we are a basket case.

Agree. The most overrated eight possie' game in VFL/AFL history! And no tackles laid. No spillages created...

For perspective:
The bloke was such a great forward... they had to play him as a mediocre ruckman. (Fortunately, against other mediocre ruckmen.)
Recruiting Tragic Joke says it all, as to what the Poodles really think of Boyd's abilities.[/quote]

Haha! Tragic must have heard you last night Dave, as he kicked a bag. I'm with you on Boyd though, they're looking for excuses to pump his tyres after their horrific knee-jerk recruitment. I honestly thought trading Boyd in would be a club wrecker, and in the ensuing mess the Doggies might find themselves on the ropes this year after a disastrous 2016...and lo and behold, after 23 rounds of one of the most average seasons I can remember, they find themselves up against a battered and bruised Sydney to snaffle the premiership chockies instead! I was overseas for the finals series and couldn't believe what I was reading!!!

So, I guess history can go on to dramatically re-write any club's recruiting faux pas, both negatively and positively.

[samuraisaint]

You make some good points here Degruch. They finished 7th to steal a grand final, very similar to Adelaide stealing one from us (and them) in 1997. What the GF taught me last year was this; if the Doggies had made it in 1997, they certainly would have thrashed us anyway. They wouldn't have let history beat them the way it has beaten us since 1971. That and the fact that we had our two best ruckmen out injured.

You don't have to have the best list to win a grand final, you need the best team. We nearly proved this in 2010. Ask Adelaide 1997-1998, Brisbane 2001-2004, and the Bulldogs last year. None of those sides ever finished on top of the ladder or came even close in their grand final years, and peaked at the right time because of their DEPTH. Not their elite talent, or A graders. You need enough of them, yes, but not more than the other team you are playing.
The best year I ever saw for us, we lost 4 of our first 5 games, including a 100 point loss to Brisbane and a 10 goal loss at home against the Swans, all in the FIRST 5 GAMES.

McCartin, Billings, Gresham, Rice, Goddard, Newnes, Sinclair and DMac will all put in together soon and we will be away. We are still waiting for them to have their break out year, but it may not be this year though. Look at it this way, with our tougher draw and the likelihood of Hawthorn finishing ninth or tenth, we will be able to bring in two more quality players, including hopefully a class midfielder, and if Roo, Dempster and Armo spend time out of the side, and with Chips retired, the younger players will need to take some ownership, without having to always shoulder the burden.

There has been too much unrealistic anticipation built up post and pre-season about us making finals. Let's face it, last year we had 7 walk up starts, this year we have two, that makes a mountain of difference. This year is a year of consolidation and we must win 11-12 games again, but any more than that will be a bonus. Has to be about realistically contending, not pretending.