Ins & Outs for round 2

[loris]

[quote="WellardSaint"]
Lonie played like a freak in his first year, /quote]

I think a lot of supporters forget the Schneider impact WS. Schnieds was taking a lot of the heat off Lonie. so he got under the guard of most opposing teams. IMHO Schneiderman was the reason behind Lonies breakout year.
Lonnie said in an interview that Schneider used to coach him out on the ground during the game as were to position himself. And washis mentor that year.

[SemperFidelis]

Carlisle needs a few weeks to remember how to run, but I'll give him a break here because it was so freaking hot inside tonight everyone around us was almost in a dead bloody faint. I can't remember conditions so oppressive.

But drop Brown? Are you serious? I thought he was one of the few shining lights. No one expected him to be fast but I thought he was good in many contests and without him I reckon we'd have lost by another bagful.

Could have used Shinner tonight, though.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SemperFidelis]

Ross will give himself a belting for that performance. Not the first to be dropped.

[Toy Saint]

We were obliterated in the ruck, Hickey looked like an incompetent sloth against Gawn. Our midflelders were always on the back foot.

I'm not a Lonie fan, but he wasn't our worst. Carslile was adequate. And I'm not a big Savage fan, but he was OK too.

Not much from Bruce and Weller. Wright showed pace early.

[Linton Lodger]

We don't know about Roo, Joey or Paddy yet, so on the assumption that Roo's right next week and that Montagna & Paddy won't be ready:

Out: Wright, Lonie, Ross

In: Acres, Sinclair, K Stevens

Incredibly, Mc Cartin is playing for Sandy tomorrow, so hopefully he'll be right, that means I'll change mine:

Out: Wright, Lonie, Ross

In: Acres, Sinclair, McCartin

[saintsRrising]

Here's a melt…

Lucky we have incredible depth because right now I have a few outs

We have depth, but also not enough elite cream. And tonight not even the depth players decided to put in. Based on effort today 75% deserved to be dropped.

[SemperFidelis]

We were obliterated in the ruck, Hickey looked like an incompetent sloth against Gawn. Our midflelders were always on the back foot.

I'm not a Lonie fan, but he wasn't our worst. Carslile was adequate. And I'm not a big Savage fan, but he was OK too.

Not much from Bruce and Weller. Wright showed pace early.

Good assessment.

[CURLY]

Paddy replaces Roo Dempster for Brown McKenzie for Wright Sinclair for Lonnie and Acres for Dunston. Hickey gets one more chance or maybe not he cost us big time today.

Also FFS Billings was one of our best until he was played deep forward.

[realdeal]

This loss starts and finishes with the midfield!
Some forwards missed gettable set shots and some defenders coughed it up under no pressure but the midfield has to take responsibility here. And the game plan.

What the he'll happened after qtr time!? They weren't that great, we were just that bad! In stkilda like from the past few years!

[CQ SAINT]

Out: Geary, Gilbert, Dunstan, Lonie, Armitage, Savage and rest Rooey

In: Mackenzie, White, Acres, Sinclair, Stevens, Long and McCartin

If improvement is the measure for the season forget improving the first 5 outs. Let them earn their money teaching the kids at Sandy to win.

How the hell did we go from Riewoldt to Geary as Captain. I have never seen Jarryn at his best because I don't get to training much but I have seen him play too often. There was more inspiration today watching Melbourne drop marks and fumble the occasional handball. It is embarrassing.

Gilbert is finished and Dunstan belongs at Sandy. Lonie rarely picks up the ball cleanly and kicks terribly when he does. His first season was a fluke, same with Luke.

We need more pace and skill/ability not fumbling, kick and hope types. We have nothing to lose. Savage is a good kick (sometimes) but lacks the courage needed to play AFL.

I don't care about the loss today but it is time to bite the bullet and get some games into our kids now. Forget finals. Next year there will be no Dempster, Roo or Montagna.
Gilbert, Savage and Geary should join them. We need to prepare for this now.


McCartin needs to do something other than be sore or injured. I wont be surprised if Josh Battle overtakes him. I'm confident he will kick more goals at Sandy than McCartin will at St.Kilda but will gladly eat my hat if Paddy can kick 20 in his next 8 games.

[White Winmar]

In : intensity and effort

Out : lethargy and lack of speed

[skeptic]

Carlisle

The statue

Stands at CHB and hopes the opposition kick it to him and not his opponent

If he is the great white hope, god help us

He is only of value if the opposition have a Kosi like fwd

Brown was worse than Carlisle IMO, he was meant to be the guy who could stop Hogan who was running rampant.

Carlisle's first game in 18 months.

The problem was that neither Carlisle or Brown were agile enough to go with Hogan. He covers a lot of ground. Did we miss Dempster? Possibly, but where I think we did miss him was that for the last few years he has been the organiser of the back line as well as the player prepared to leave his opponent to help a teammate. Players like Roberton look good when they are the free man but are under pressure when they have to defend/man up. This zone defence is good when your midfield is on top but when not, a defender should play man on man. The basic 'job' of a defender is to beat your opponent first and foremost and then attack. Maybe I am just old fashioned.

Really good post... backs were super disorganised

[lefty]

Out - Midfield
That's where the game was lost, as per usual.

Ross terrible, did nothing and ran out of steam
Armatige terrible, did nothing and seems slow
Hickey terrible, but playing against the best ruckman in the league
Weller - terrible, needs to practice kicking straight

Would also be nice if the backline actually played man on man from a center bounce.

I thought Wright was OK, least he runs, saw him get someone from 50+m away holding the ball.

I also think Newness hurt his shoulder again? Didn't look right.

I also think we are simply not fit enough, or we'd done too much work during the week and had tired ourselves out.

[coopergrech]

In: Montagna, ACRES, DEMPSTER, Minchington & McCartin
Out: Wright, Lonie,Gilbert,Dunstan & WELLER/ROSS (Make a statement)

Weller/Ross will survive if Roo doesn't play. But they need to make a statement and drop players like them that think they'll just stay in the team week in week out, because of previous form..

I'm a Hickey fan, but gee he looked really lazy today. If Koby Stevens is available maybe bring him in also for Webster..

Savage survives at this stage...

[To the top]

There is talent on our List.

BUT, as long as we have Geary as Captain we will be the joke of the competition.

Then you can add Savage, Webster and Lonie.

There are 4 players just not at AFL level, and never will be.

Brown looked very suspect - but what is our alternative?

And don't tell me Dempster!

We are talking about someone playing full back - and Kennedy looms next week.

Simply, the likes of Acres and White need to be in the side and why they have not been managed to that status is a blight on the Football Department.

We play a zone defence of witches hats because we have the likes of Geary, Webster and Savage running round in our back 6.

Sorry, did I say running?

That should read "standing"

You can now see why the progress of Freeman is so vital to our chances.

And the question on Membrey remains - who did he kick his bags of 5 on and what did he do otherwise?

Weller was also very poor - as was Wright.

I would have taken Geary off and thrown Wright into defence - to man up and negate.

In fact, Carlisle tried, Gresham tried and looked classy at times and Roo tried.

But that was the end of the penny section.

[saintbob]

Lonie is NO where near AFL standard and I'm not sure what Richo sees in him.

Brown played like an absolute spud.

Mav kicked very poorly, 4 very gettable shots on goal and didn't look like slotting one.

Richo and co were the most disappointing on the night

Ins: Acres, Dempster, McCartin and Sinclair

Outs: Brown, Wright, Riewoldt and Lonie

[Jacks Back]

We can't be serious if players like Webster (who can't keep his feet), Wright (who runs around like a headless chook, had only 8 possessions and 1 tackle) and Lonie (too small and no good at AFL level) are in our "best 22".

Also Brown is not best 22 but we currently don't have a tall full back apart from him.

And before some one jumps up and down about Lonie - I'm not saying small players are no good (look at Caleb Daniel) I'm saying Lonie is currently not up to AFL level.

Out: Lonie, Wright, Webster, Ross, Rooey (if injured)
IN: 8cres, McKenzie, Sinclair, Minchington, McCartin (if Rooey is injured)

[White Winmar]

We can't be serious if players like Webster (who can't keep his feet), Wright (who runs around like a headless chook, had only 8 possessions and 1 tackle) and Lonie (too small and no good at AFL level) are in our "best 22".

Also Brown is not best 22 but we currently don't have a tall full back apart from him.

And before some one jumps up and down about Lonie - I'm not saying small players are no good (look at Caleb Daniel) I'm saying Lonie is currently not up to AFL level.

Out: Lonie, Wright, Webster, Ross, Rooey (if injured)
IN: 8cres, McKenzie, Sinclair, Minchington, McCartin (if Rooey is injured)

We need to persist with Ross. He is the future. No Minch for me. Otherwise, hard to disagree, JB.

[dragit]

Alright I've calmed down now…

Actually feel for Lonie, he didn't pick the team, nor was he responsible for our midfield woes… I think he tried really hard, think he'd probably trying too hard at present. He had a team high 6 tackles, 3 clearances but coughed it up a few times… not our worst though IMO.

I honestly don't know why we were so out-worked, they had 120 more disposals yet still had 8 more tackles.

Our ball use was very ordinary,

For us to win
Savage has to have more than 8 kicks
Bruce has to take more than 2 marks
Wright is in the side to tackle and had 1 - he has to go this week.
Who was worse out of Dunstan, Ross & Armitage… tough call - Probably Ross with 4 clangers and only 1 tackle.

Next week is going to be tough with any combination but I'm thinking something like

Out
Lonie, Ross, Wright, Riewoldt

In
Stevens, Acres, Montagna, McCartin

Left field: we could throw Long in the deep end to apply some forward pressure, he seemed to love a tackle.

No chance Richo will drop Ross though.

[shrodes]

Left field: we could throw Long in the deep end to apply some forward pressure, he seemed to love a tackle.

Still suspended for round 2 and eligible to be picked from round 3

[Vazelos]

I thought Lonie did Ok but long term there are better candidates to come in.

Long to come in Round 3 I just think we need to have a real good look at this kid.

In for Round 2: Montagna, Acres, Mc Cartin, K Stevens
Out: Wright, Lonie, Dunstan Riewoldt

It will be fast game out there, need better midfielders.

[terry smith rules]

Out: Geary, Gilbert, Dunstan, Lonie, Armitage, Savage and rest Rooey

In: Mackenzie, White, Acres, Sinclair, Stevens, Long and McCartin

If improvement is the measure for the season forget improving the first 5 outs. Let them earn their money teaching the kids at Sandy to win.

How the hell did we go from Riewoldt to Geary as Captain. I have never seen Jarryn at his best because I don't get to training much but I have seen him play too often. There was more inspiration today watching Melbourne drop marks and fumble the occasional handball. It is embarrassing.



.

He dropped one mark and one hanball was not timed, but sure if you can point out the others then go ahead.

One game in and we get "supporters" like you and To the Top quickly back on your hobby horse

I tell you this if we make the 8 this year and #14 leads us out, I will be reminding you of this post

fqf

[CQ SAINT]

Out: Geary, Gilbert, Dunstan, Lonie, Armitage, Savage and rest Rooey

In: Mackenzie, White, Acres, Sinclair, Stevens, Long and McCartin

If improvement is the measure for the season forget improving the first 5 outs. Let them earn their money teaching the kids at Sandy to win.

How the hell did we go from Riewoldt to Geary as Captain. I have never seen Jarryn at his best because I don't get to training much but I have seen him play too often. There was more inspiration today watching Melbourne drop marks and fumble the occasional handball. It is embarrassing.



.

He dropped one mark and one hanball was not timed, but sure if you can point out the others then go ahead.

One game in and we get "supporters" like you and To the Top quickly back on your hobby horse

I tell you this if we make the 8 this year and #14 leads us out, I will be reminding you of this post

fqf

Really. Ok. Chaleenge accepted. I want to apologise to Jarryn and the coaching staff in advance but clearly this needs to be pointed out for 'barrackers' like you.

His stats are unremarkable when you track them. He has made a career out of running hard, back and forward and being very average when he gets it,with his very average 15 or 16 possessions and 2 tackles a game, in sides where the ball has spent a lot of time in defence and while he 'regularly beats the best small forwards in the comps'. What a load of shite.

00:30 retrieved ball after point, passed it to Savage and asked for a short one as he returned. jogged 15 metres to the pocket sideways alone, knowing he was going to get it, dropped the mark, hand balled to pressure a position for a scrappy defensive 50 rebound. Easy stat, very little thought in it. Billings ended up with a stunning goal after a turnover from Melbourne, after a turnover from us.

1:15 Dropped easy over head mark under pressure. Out of position when ball turned over 10 seconds later in the middle - Hogan in one on one no one to cut off the space.

3.24 Back of pack easy receive standing still, stupid hand ball backwards to Armitage under pressure and in congestion, turnover 1 possession later. Geary watched Gartlett run in and kick an easy goal, in an open forward line, from 40 meter square.

6.49 Out of position behind Hogan who gets an easy mark. Not smart.

8.25 Ineffective tackle being rag dolled as he clings onto Watts.

10:00 Alone, across halve back reading play, easy mark intercept and clean 15 meter pass. 1st effective possession in six attempts. the ball goes around in a big circle backwards.

10:25 Geary receives easy mark alone, in the same place he kicked the ball to 20 seconds earlier, and chips a s*** kick 15 metres along the boundary which would have gone out on the full, if Steven didn't get to it just in time. 2nd effective disposal but just.

10:53 Geary lurking behind play alone again, gets handball receive and gets caught, kick smothered ineffective, he gets another chance after picking up his own scraps and the same s*** happens again. 2 effective disposals quickly countered by 2 fumbling errors, poor judgement, poor awareness and very average composure under pressure in 1:53 of football. So Geary gets near the ball (close enough to touch it or spoil it) 8 times in 10 minutes and has 2 effective possessions. Then Geary runs away pointing his finger and telling others where to go. FFS. A true leader.

Do you really want me to go on. Its no problem but I'm pretty sure someone at the club is paid to do this, Somehow this guy is our captain. At this point our stats are outweighing Melbourne's remarkably (at about 50% efficiency) and we are running hard and applying heaps of pressure, getting turn overs and banging it forward heaps but alas, we are behind.

13:33 Centre bounce, ball tapped forward by Melbourne, a short kick goes to Geary's running path, he is quick and in the right spot, he takes an easy mark with time and space, in his usual style he pounds it on his boot because he senses pressure. The commentary is "Geary mark, boots it clear and wide, sets Gresham a task", Gresh is 5 metres ahead of his opponent on the true hf flank. Gresh eventually chases down Geary's kick a meter in from the boundary but cant keep it in. Geary virtually kicked it from the centre circle. A straight 40 metre neat kick in front of Gresh was all that was required. Geary cant handle pressure. Then he runs around pointing his finger and yelling instructions. He is a professional trier.

Are you getting the picture yet Terry? Sure, Geary wasn't alone yesterday and he has been under the pump his whole career and there is no one else, blah blah blah. Did you get inspired, excited and go home thinking gee, what a Captain we have. He is a scapegoat for poor strategies and a role model for poor execution in my humble opinion. I'm entitled to it too. I didn't really want to run down Geary but you asked.

I respect your defence of Jarryn, it is noble, loyal and all that jazz, but in my opinion it is abhorrent that a guy who tries hard and runs hard and does very little other than stop the best small forward from getting the ball, (while our midfielders and forwards chase his errant disposals and apply heaps of pressure and tackles, restricting the delivery of the ball to those opposing best small forward), gets to be our Captain moving forward. He is leading us to a top 5 draft pick is about all.

After 140+ games of this type of mediocrity, he wont improve and if he does lead us to the finals it wont be because he got better.

End of rant.

[Con Gorozidis]

Minch is miles better than Lonie.

What is it with Lonie? The choir boy hair-cut? So what if he tries like Scrappy do. He is very slow, gets caught a heck of a lot and most of his tackles are easily broken. Every now and then he lays a tackle because he sneaks up and noon sees him coming cos he is so small.

[CQ SAINT]

Minch is miles better than Lonie.

What is it with Lonie? The choir boy hair-cut? So what if he tries like Scrappy do. He is very slow, gets caught a heck of a lot and most of his tackles are easily broken. Every now and then he lays a tackle because he sneaks up and noon sees him coming cos he is so small.

Sinclair is better than them both. Long will be too. They are both more suited to the midfield as well.