Paddy McCartin on track for St Kilda’s opening pre-season ga

[Bluthy]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/t ... 21a13d31dd

All positive but you'd expect that. Hopefully can put all the concussion incidents behind him (crosses everything that can be crossed on my body)

[citywest]

Please copy and paste the whole article for us that don't subscribe.

[Bluthy]

I don't subscribe and I can see it

ST KILDA key forward Paddy McCartin has fully recovered from last year’s concussion worries as he attempts to lock down a permanent berth next season.

The Saints’ No.1 draft pick suffered three head knocks last year, including blows in Rounds 11 and 15, sparking concerns about his long-term future in the game.

A broken collarbone against Richmond in Round 22 rounded out a frustrating second season for the 20-year-old.

But the 194cm goalkicker has resumed full training with the main group this summer and will push for selection in the Saints’ opening pre-season game against Port Adelaide at Etihad Stadium next month.

His return will bolster the Saints’ big man options for next season along with the return of key defender Hugh Goddard from a debilitating achilles problem, ex-Essendon swingman Jake Carlisle and former Magpie stopper Nathan Brown.

Importantly, the club is confident McCartin has avoided any long-term issues from the head blows and the troubling complications that have ended a handful of players’ careers over the past two seasons.

Melbourne’s Heritier Lumumba retired due to concussion fears last month, following similar moves from concussion victims Sam Blease (Geelong and Melbourne), Leigh Adams (North Melbourne) and Brisbane trio Justin Clarke, Matt Maguire and Jonathan Brown.

Paddy McCartin at St Kilda training on Saturday. Picture: Wayne Ludbey
Collingwood’s Ben Sinclair also sustained four concussion bouts last season but, like McCartin, is also on the comeback trail.

The Saints have high hopes for McCartin after using their top pick in the 2014 national draft to pluck the Geelong Falcons’ full forward over dynamic Melbourne midfielder Christian Petracca.

St Kilda coach Alan Richardson said he was encouraged by McCartin’s development despite some frustrating setbacks in 2016.

He finished with 14 goals from 11 games including an impressive 10-mark haul in the 46-point win over Essendon in Round 9.

Richardson said the forward, who also manages diabetes, was working hard on becoming a more rounded player.

“I liked Paddy’s year, I thought that he showed us what he is capable of. For obvious reasons we didn’t see it as often as we’d like with the concussions and then ultimately the collarbone, but he got himself in much better shape and was able to be much more involved in the game both offensively and defensively,” Richardson said.

Paddy McCartin jostles with Nathan Brown at training. Picture: Wayne Ludbey
“We all know that Paddy’s going to be a terrific mark but he needs to be so much more than that and he’s growing that facet of his play so he can be much more involved.

“It was disappointing not to be able to get more footy into Paddy, but we’re incredibly optimistic and bullish about what Paddy’s going to be able to become.”

St Kilda has a spread of key forward options this season following the breakthroughs of fellow goalkickers Tim Membrey and spearhead Josh Bruce.

Superstar Nick Riewoldt played further up the ground last year and will offload the captaincy, most likely to Jarryn Geary, ahead of next season.

Richardson said McCartin’s attitude off the field could not be faulted as he worked back to regain his position last season after the head knocks.

“He wants to be out there playing, particularly as the year unfolded and it became really exciting with the prospect of playing finals he really wanted to be out there,” Richardson told the club’s website.

“He did whatever the doctors asked of him, trained hard, gave himself every opportunity to be in good shape when it was that he was to come back.”

5 hours ago
Must consider wearing a helmet if he continues to be concussed

FlagShareLikeReply
Oopster
Oopster 2 hours ago
@Frank possibly, but he is a bull at a gate who has to realise he's no longer playing TAC and needs to protect his head.

FlagShareLikeReply
SCOTT
SCOTT 6 hours ago
2014 National draft had exceptional talent. I had serious doubts about the Saints picking this kid over Petracca especially as recruiter Chris Pelkin left the saints because they wanted McCArtin over Petracca

FlagShareLikeReply
polly
polly 13 hours ago
Agree with Oopster. Paddy has to to be conscious of friendly fire; but also teammates need to work well with him. imagine Paddy, Bruce and Membrey all contesting the mark? Paddy should use his body and strength to manoeuvre like Tom Hawkins does at times. Go Saints!

FlagShareLikeReply
Oopster
Oopster 14 hours ago
He has to learn to protect himself when flying recklessly in packs. One was self-inflicted and another so-called friendly fire. However, in the game he broke his collarbone he was tearing Rance a new one. If he can stay fit and healthy he will be an absolute beauty.

FlagShare1JohnLikeReply
SCOTT
SCOTT 6 hours ago
@Oopster That's the million dollar question isn't it? Clearly the forward line is congested with the likes of Membrey and Bruce. Those guys should clear out and leave the forward 50 to McCartin and one or two crumbers as this guy will be a beauty. Bruce shouldn't even be a forward in my opinion as he does nothing up there

FlagShareLikeReply
Oopster
Oopster 4 hours ago
@SCOTT Bruce has kicked a 100 over the last two years, Membrey plays like a ruck-rover and is a hard match-up. Forwards don't get the forward 50 anymore, not against good defensive teams anyway. Bruce was better in 2015 when Reiwoldt was forward, these guys just need to play more games together to get it right. The Saints will bat deeper in the midfield this year and one suspects even deeper next year with a couple of free agency players on their radar. A stronger midfield should provide better delivery and more of it.

FlagShare1CraigLikeReply
polly
polly 3 hours ago
@SCOTT @Oopster I think you will find Bruce will prove a nightmare for opposition teams when Paddy and Membrey are being tracked; particularly being assisted by some good crumbers.

FlagShareLikeReply
leon
leon 19 hours ago
Rubbish article. Could have chatted to club docs last year to know they were being safe and no real worries.

FlagShare2JohnJamesLikeReply
SCOTT
SCOTT 6 hours ago
@leon Agree

FlagShare

[bigcarl]

Great set of hands and just a natural footballer. He ought to wear a helmet, though, to protect that melon

[saintspremiers]

Please copy and paste the whole article for us that don't subscribe.

There is a way to read HS articles if you don't subscribe. But I won't be telling you. It has been mentioned on the forum in the past.

[borderbarry]

News.com.au

[st.byron]

Please copy and paste the whole article for us that don't subscribe.

Just put the article title into Google. You can read it from the links that come up. Don't know why, but it bypasses the paywall.

[Playon]

Great set of hands and just a natural footballer. He ought to wear a helmet, though, to protect that melon

He needs to be told to wear one. He cant keep going down this path, not only does it out him out for how many weeks each season? Its not good for his health.

Hell do I like wearing a bucket every time I ride a bike?

[skeptic]

Great set of hands and just a natural footballer. He ought to wear a helmet, though, to protect that melon

He needs to be told to wear one. He cant keep going down this path, not only does it out him out for how many weeks each season? Its not good for his health.

Hell do I like wearing a bucket every time I ride a bike?

I think the problem is that the old helmets don't actually do much to protect the head from concussion from falls... which IIRC has been the problem for Paddy.

They're more to protect you from a stray elbow etc.

Head to ground though forget about it

[samoht]

This device (not even a helmet - more like a collar) protects even the "head to ground". A bit bulky perhaps - would take some getting used to, maybe?
It seems to be lightweight. Why not?

[Jacks Back]

Great set of hands and just a natural footballer. He ought to wear a helmet, though, to protect that melon

He needs to be told to wear one. He cant keep going down this path, not only does it out him out for how many weeks each season? Its not good for his health.

Hell do I like wearing a bucket every time I ride a bike?

I think the problem is that the old helmets don't actually do much to protect the head from concussion from falls... which IIRC has been the problem for Paddy.

They're more to protect you from a stray elbow etc.

Head to ground though forget about it

And yet helmets are required for bike riders. Why, if they do nothing? Surely helmets help their wearers.

[BigMart]

Are you saying Paddy should wear a bike helmet?

Not sure the two helmets are remotely similar??

Should Nick Riewoldt wear a helmet, he's been knocked out a number of times?

[White Winmar]

Helmets do work. They are not the complete answer, but think of this. If riding your bike, and you fell off, would you rather hit your head on the road with, or without a helmet on? Same on a football field. It won't offer complete protection, but it will limit the severity of the impact. It is crucial for diabetics as well, because of their greater vulnerability to blows to the brain. It really is a no brainer (pun intended). He is a few concussions away from his career being brought to an end. Counting his last year in under 18's, he's had five concussions in three years. He can't really afford any more. A reason to be fearful.

[saintsRrising]

Helmets do work. They are not the complete answer, but think of this. If riding your bike, and you fell off, would you rather hit your head on the road with, or without a helmet on? Same on a football field. It won't offer complete protection, but it will limit the severity of the impact. It is crucial for diabetics as well, because of their greater vulnerability to blows to the brain. It really is a no brainer (pun intended). He is a few concussions away from his career being brought to an end. Counting his last year in under 18's, he's had five concussions in three years. He can't really afford any more. A reason to be fearful.

Sorry but have to disagree and you are mixing up protecting from concussion and protecting from bone fractures etc.

http://sma.org.au/2013/11/helmets-do-no ... oncussion/

https://www.sportsafetyinternational.or ... met-study/


My wife once came off her bicycle at 60kmphr and landed head first. Her helmet saved her life, but did not save her from concussion. She suffered amongst others things a TBI (traumatic brain injury) and took many months to recover, Her initial concussion was so sever that for over a week she could not recall anything immediately after it was said. If I walked her down the hall she could not retrace her steps. When asked what year it was over the first week her answers varied from 1911 to 2057.


Helmets do not prevent concussion in sports, and can even make concussion worse in some instances as by increasing the effective head size they can increase the rotational acceleration, and thus increase what causes concussion.


By way of explanation, think of the brain as a very soft object floating in fluid in a very hard object (the skull). When there is sudden acceleration, or deceleration, the brain bangs against your skull on the opposite side to what you may first think. For example when my wife's skull hit the pavement the skull stopped instantly, the brain however in its fluid kept moving before banging into into the her skull 180 degrees opposite the point of impact (ie at the back of her skull and not at the front).The microdamage to her brain was worst on the side of her brain that impacted the skull, and not on the side where her head impacted the pavement.

Helmets do not prevent concussion as they are on the outside of the skull and are not on the inside. The brain if the head stops quickly, or moves quickly, will still impact the skull. Concussion will occur despite what is on the outside of the skull.


So if a player needs to protect a healing fracture then wear one. But to protect from concussion it will do no good.

[White Winmar]

Agree SR. They don't stop concussion, but for a diabetic, any protective measure is better than none. I didn't want to give the impression that helmets prevent concussion, there is enough evidence to suggest they don't offer much. However, my research into diabetics with brain injury indicate their brains are more vulnerable to the effects and they take longer to recover. I'll have to dig the NFL research on this. I can't find it ATM. I think history has shown that concussion has devastated many NFL players over time, despite the compulsory use of helmets.

A physio once described concussion to me as a "bounce" injury. The sudden deceleration causes the "second" impact, which she said was often worse than the initial impact. There is a touch of the climate science debate about this argument. The majority of research evidence supports you, SR, however there are a few others who swear by the compulsory use of helmets to prevent the severity and duration of concussion. I certainly lean towards your argument. The majority of research supports it. The emotional side of me fears for a young man's career and his long term health.

[minneapolis]

Are you saying Paddy should wear a bike helmet?

Not sure the two helmets are remotely similar??

Should Nick Riewoldt wear a helmet, he's been knocked out a number of times?

I completely agree. He should wear two helmets. Better safe than sorry.

Or as we say, Nathan to worry about now.

[6621104]

helmets may not stop a concussion but are designed to slow the deceleration that contributes to it and dissipate some of the force in compression. Thus the layers of compressible material and the caveat that once a helmet has absorbed an impact, even though externally it looks undamaged as the foam may have been permanently compressed and thus worthless it should be replaced. They may make the concussion less severe.

[Sainter_Dad]

Has anyone asked the question as to whether or not Paddy can or will play in a helmet? It may be a moot point having the discussion about Pros and Cons.

[saintsRrising]

helmets may not stop a concussion but are designed to slow the deceleration that contributes to it and dissipate some of the force in compression. Thus the layers of compressible material and the caveat that once a helmet has absorbed an impact, even though externally it looks undamaged as the foam may have been permanently compressed and thus worthless it should be replaced. They may make the concussion less severe.

The design you are speaking of is a bicycle, or motorcycle, helmet and not an AFL football helmet which are of the "padded" type.

However with AFL football helmets:

http://www.aflcommunityclub.com.au/index.php?id=883
Helmets

There is no definitive scientific evidence that helmets prevent concussion or other brain injuries in Australian football.
Some experts believe that younger players who wear a helmet may change their playing style, and receive more head impacts as a result. Accordingly, while there is no scientific evidence either way, helmets are not recommended for the prevention of concussion.

Helmets may have a role in the protection of players on return to play following specific injuries (e.g. face or skull fractures).


The research is skeptical at best about biycycle helmets preventing concussion, and even more so for a sport like AFL.

[skeptic]

Like I said before, a helmet will protect a player (to a degree) from concussion from a stray elbow or incidental contact in pack but they are almost useless in preventing a concussion if the player's head hits the ground with force... it may prevent a fracture sure.

SRS has nailed it

[lefty]

Pretty sure a helmet that only uses padding (I'm not talking 1980's stack hat) will definitely slow down the acceleration / impact.
The concept is no not different to an air-bag slowing down your head from hitting the steering wheel.
Yes, it won't eliminate concussion / having a sore head, but I am 100% certain it sure will help reduce it, even if its 5%, its better than nothing.

I'm also willing to nearly bet my left nut that in 5 years time, the so called 'studies' will show a different result and all of a sudden, its the other way around. Happens all the time.

[saintsRrising]

Pretty sure a helmet that only uses padding (I'm not talking 1980's stack hat) will definitely slow down the acceleration / impact.
The concept is no not different to an air-bag slowing down your head from hitting the steering wheel.

There is a world of difference. Try jumping off a 6th floor onto an airbag vs a padded mat. One will kill you.

Yes, it won't eliminate concussion / having a sore head, but I am 100% certain it sure will help reduce it, even if its 5%, its better than nothing.

I'm also willing to nearly bet my left nut that in 5 years time, the so called 'studies' will show a different result and all of a sudden, its the other way around. Happens all the time.

We are actually talking about studies that have been made over decades. The more recent revision of the data is what is now indicating that helmets for minimising concussion have no or little value, and that when rotational deceleration is involved may actually be harmful.

[bigcarl]

I'm also willing to nearly bet my left nut that in 5 years time, the so called 'studies' will show a different result and all of a sudden, its the other way around. Happens all the time.

Is that why they call you lefty?

I agree with your sentiments. Some protection's got to be better than none. You don't see too many helmetless cyclists/motorcyclists around.

As I understand it, the jury is out on the sports "science" behind the current thinking .

[minneapolis]

Pretty sure a helmet that only uses padding (I'm not talking 1980's stack hat) will definitely slow down the acceleration / impact.
The concept is no not different to an air-bag slowing down your head from hitting the steering wheel.
Yes, it won't eliminate concussion / having a sore head, but I am 100% certain it sure will help reduce it, even if its 5%, its better than nothing.

I'm also willing to nearly bet my left nut that in 5 years time, the so called 'studies' will show a different result and all of a sudden, its the other way around. Happens all the time.

Even thought I agree with you, I don't think you can make that bet Righty. I am pretty sure you lost a similar bet a while back. Check the filing cabinet.