St KFC Cult of Messiah....

[Teflon]

Good read front page of todays Aged (no not by Caro) that makes a really valid point about where we are as a club and where we have been. Yes yes its a newspaper article that doesnt name sources....but stick with me....its the sentiment Im interested in....

The first quote captures most of what Ive always felt about our club - we focus on the individual....cause we've never had the team success and dont really get what it means to have success as a team - on or off the field (see current off field dribble). We simply dont know how to hang tough and pull together.

Quote 1

" Knowing St Kilda, the new mob will probably get in." says a club insider. "This club has always had a cult of the messiah about it. One person or one player who will come in and deliver everything. Always the great individual players - Barker, then Lockett, bringing back Baldock to coach then Tim Watson, Malcolm Blight, Butters AND Thomas , now this bloke..."

This quote really reverberated with me - go through the names...its true...they were all "gonna get us that flag and put us on the path to rightousness"....and now on the forum we see the clamour to get Judd.........and away we go again.....for this reason alone I KNOW Westaway will get elected.......I just hope Saintsd fans AT LEAST ask some tough questions before going for the messiah and getting the "naughty boy"...

The other quote concerns "Thommos revenge" from a club insider affiliated with neither Thomas OR Butters......I do get a stronmg sense Grants gone remarkably quiet this past week....cause things in his eyes are looking up...

[saint patrick]

Hard to deny it has been at play....Will be the monkey on the back until we can throw it to the shizenhousen

Hopefully sooner rather than later

[Teflon]

Its true though isnt it Pat?

Our asolutions are always the individual - moreso than any other club in the league I reckon. Thats why in part I like Lyon - his whole philospohy when playing or at Sydney was about hard work, team work, - he isnt the type to revel in the top 5 superstars for a BBQ at his house each week.....he KNOWS the improvement will come from lower down.

[Otiman]

Whilst i don't want to get into the old debate on this, whether the new board gets up or not, it has certainly destabilised the current board (and club as well). Right now, it doesn't matter which mob gets up, there will be some irrepairable damage to our club and its 'good' name.

It's damage control mode now, from both parties.

[saint patrick]

Its true though isnt it Pat?

Our asolutions are always the individual - moreso than any other club in the league I reckon. Thats why in part I like Lyon - his whole philospohy when playing or at Sydney was about hard work, team work, - he isnt the type to revel in the top 5 superstars for a BBQ at his house each week.....he KNOWS the improvement will come from lower down.

Yes its true ....inevitable for a club that has one flag in over a hundred years and you are right...Ross Lyon is just the sort of pragmatic ,no bull type of character to put the groundwork in for sustained longterm success.

Look forward to the day when we no longer need a Messiah or at least acknowledge them retrospectively

[joffaboy]

" Knowing St Kilda, the new mob will probably get in." says a club insider. "This club has always had a cult of the messiah about it. One person or one player who will come in and deliver everything. Always the great individual players - Barker, then Lockett, bringing back Baldock to coach then Tim Watson, Malcolm Blight, Butters AND Thomas , now this bloke..."

This quote really reverberated with me - go through the names...its true...they were all "gonna get us that flag and put us on the path to rightousness"....and now on the forum we see the clamour to get Judd.........and away we go again.....for this reason alone I KNOW Westaway will get elected.......I just hope Saintsd fans AT LEAST ask some tough questions before going for the messiah and getting the "naughty boy"...

The other quote concerns "Thommos revenge" from a club insider affiliated with neither Thomas OR Butters......I do get a stronmg sense Grants gone remarkably quiet this past week....cause things in his eyes are looking up...

Yup teflon felt the exact same way.

I thought the actual piece was pretty crappy journalism, however what you quoted above rings so true.

Every since the alternative group announced its intention to challenge, I thought there has been an indecent haste to embrace the new messiahs and dump the old one.

It is the STKFC version of Life of Brian.

It was here for all to see this time last year when Thomas was shown not to be the messiah but instead o be just another naughty boy, the followers fell of quick smart (while some of the flock stayed faithful).

Now the naughty boy is Butters and the followers have jumped off and have a new messiah in Westaway. How long before he is not the messiah bt just another naughty boy?

Really it pains me to say, but I think opposition supporters are correct when they say we have a poor culture. We look for messiahs to lead us to promised land, while clubs like Nth Melbourne, o the bones of their arses make an impact on the finals through sheer force of will as a team not as a cult of personality or celebration of celebrity.

Until we fix this midset, our club, our wonderful, fantastic, frustrating, infuriating, rabble of a club, will forever be that one step out of touch and out of reach of the flag, waiting for the white knight to come along and carry us to the ultimate victory.

Really is distressing the way our club destroys itself and its chances.

But what is one going to do - it is for life. My club right or wrong will forever be my club.

[rodgerfox]

Interestingly, who would actually vote for Westaway?

Him alone?

I think this article is outdated.

Butterss is an example of the tail wagging the dog.

I don't think anyone would vote for Westaway thinking that he a messiah. People may vote for him to remove a person who has taken the club the way in which the article bags our club for.

Some are bagging Westway for not going on the Footy Show. I applaud that. Our club shouldn't be about a single personality.

Contrary to the article, I see SFF as opposite to what this piece of 'journalism' pots us for.

The STKFC has been about Rod Butterss for a while. In his eyes anyway.

I tell you what, he's going to miss the media exposure he's had!

[joffaboy]

Contrary to the article, I see SFF as opposite to what this piece of 'journalism' pots us for.

So thats why they got an all time champion and a ten year veteran onboard.

Two of the disciples of the new Westaway messiah sure to be a hit with the congregation of the church of cult of personality worship.

You are in denial RogerFox and it is this type of mentality that holds the club back and will never allow it to go forward like a Nth Melbourne.

Mabye teflon is correct and Ross Lyon can change it on the field. I cant see it changing as far as the average supporer goes though.

Good luck Ross, you will need it.

[linz]

Our last premiership coach wasn't exactly exciting. He was however pragmatic. I believe Lyon has a similar ilk. No BS.

[saint patrick]

Contrary to the article, I see SFF as opposite to what this piece of 'journalism' pots us for.

So thats why they got an all time champion and a ten year veteran onboard.

Two of the disciples of the new Westaway messiah sure to be a hit with the congregation of the church of cult of personality worship.

You are in denial RogerFox and it is this type of mentality that holds the club back and will never allow it to go forward like a Nth Melbourne.

Mabye teflon is correct and Ross Lyon can change it on the field. I cant see it changing as far as the average supporer goes though.

Good luck Ross, you will need it.

Joffa is it possible that Burke and Thompson are on board with the SFF group because

1: they see the need for changes at the St.Kilds Football Club

2 :they have done their due diligence before getting involved and believe this group can take the club forward

Think the idea that they are being used as stool pigeons is a bit of of an insult to their intelligence and integrity

[Garibaldi]

change the name of the club and then list the big relevant names and you'll stick the tag on every team at some stage in their existence.
Its journalistic hyperbole, means nothing but hopes to influence people so that it will.

[Teflon]

Our last premiership coach wasn't exactly exciting. He was however pragmatic. I believe Lyon has a similar ilk. No BS.

I agree Linz and thats how I see him also - Lyon has that old school hard edge ...worsefold also has it I reckon.......they dont flinch.

Rodgerfox - appreciate your attempts to turn this thread into a political debate - it isnt about that. Its a reflection on where our club is and why........and as I said when I read this I thought...f@rk we just create celebreties........Joffas celebrity celebration is an apt quote.

Look at the players we have had over years - we should own 3 or 4 at least Premiership Cups.....but somehow we find a way to implode and wait for the next messiah to roll in.

[joffaboy]

Joffa is it possible that Burke and Thompson are on board because

1: they see the need for changes at the St.Kilds Football Club

2 :they have done their due diligence before getting involved and believe this group can take the club forward

Think the idea that they are being used as stool pigeons is a bit of of an insult to their intelligence and integrity

Mabye all of the above.

Haven't heard from Thommo, but Burke has certainly been the frontman and used to excite the unwashed.

Umm - Send your proxies to me or Nathan Burke.

Nan not using their integrity or status at all.

Who is running for President?

Who fronted the Footy Show last Thursday?

As for due diligence. On what prey tell? Hopefully it was on the strategic plan and financial forecasts for the next couple of years.

You know the one the FFS is so eager to get examined by everyone including the voting members (send your proxies to me or Nathan Burke but dont ask questions)

the messiah will look after you.

All hail messiah Greg and his team of white knight templars

Oh God help us

[Teflon]

change the name of the club and then list the big relevant names and you'll stick the tag on every team at some stage in their existence.
Its journalistic hyperbole, means nothing but hopes to influence people so that it will.

Wish it was that easy to dismiss but look at some other clubs -

North - aint known for the turn over and implosions we are
Essendon - what happened to their coup? (already dead)
Bulldogs - Nobody works harder than Smorgon/Rose
Sydney - do most of their work out of the media
Adelaide - well run machine

You can go on - not even Richmond who have gone south for a long time have the Big Bang the saints have. Remember Blight? Now its Thomas/Butters...and NOW Westaway........we roll on...

Bit more than hyperbole I reckon and its also why our players get put on pedestals that eclipse many AFL clubs.

[GeorgeYoung27]

change the name of the club and then list the big relevant names and you'll stick the tag on every team at some stage in their existence.
Its journalistic hyperbole, means nothing but hopes to influence people so that it will.

sums it up perfectly.

a piece of crap writing from a no-name writer. Imagine including Barker in that list, hardly the messiah. The only truth is St Kilda supporters are more likely to pot their own club than most other teams. Just spend a few minutes on Saintsational to get the picture.

[Teflon]

change the name of the club and then list the big relevant names and you'll stick the tag on every team at some stage in their existence.
Its journalistic hyperbole, means nothing but hopes to influence people so that it will.

sums it up perfectly.

a piece of crap writing from a no-name writer. Imagine including Barker in that list, hardly the messiah. The only truth is St Kilda supporters are more likely to pot their own club than most other teams. Just spend a few minutes on Saintsational to get the picture.

what and saints fanxs have no reason for 1 flag in 100 years to pot their team?

Cmon Geroge......ofcourse Barker was a messiah -what do you call the chase for Blight and Watson before him....messiah hunting to me........Fox was the same..........we always need A hero to get us out of sh!t........before that itself turns to sh!t.

[joffaboy]

what and saints fanxs have no reason for 1 flag in 100 years to pot their team?

Cmon Geroge......ofcourse Barker was a messiah -what do you call the chase for Blight and Watson before him....messiah hunting to me........Fox was the same..........we always need A hero to get us out of sh!t........before that itself turns to sh!t.

And it is because of the one flag in a 100 years that this mentality has permeated and festered.

Really thought that under Butters and Thomas it had changed, but sadly they were just two more pretenders, and here comes a whole bunch more.
Bring on the next bunch of saviours.

[The Peanut]

I am probably not entirely sticking to the thread here but it saves starting a new one . . . and it echo's some relevance’s.

It is my view there will already be enough votes in the mail for a change of board - so if I am right we the voters are going to be held responsible for every tiny little piece of rubbish the gutter journalists dragged up throughout the reign of the SFF ticket. And a long and prosperous reign I hope too.

So I'm getting in first to apologise to all for my vote and causing the St Kilda turmoil and demise in advance.

I voted because I have had enough of the current board and am hoping that the new group can take us the next step and that’s pretty well it. Whether it’s repeating our history or not doesn’t worry me in the least. My concern now is keeping the new lot true to their word.

You can whip the cat until the cows come home but in the end the cat has got a bare backside and the cows need milking.

Here is an interesting SS link that popped up shortly before the SFF ticket did.
http://www.saintsational.com/forum/view ... hp?t=35559

[joffaboy]

So do you think anyone who has reservations about the new messiahs will rejoice if the whole thing falls on it arse?

Fair Dinkum. You think our egos are so big that to prove an internet point we would be happy if our fears are realised?

Thats right i would be wrapt for the club to go down the s.hitter so I could proclaim some kind of moral internet victory

God help us and our poor rabble of a club.

[GeorgeYoung27]

what and saints fanxs have no reason for 1 flag in 100 years to pot their team?

Cmon Geroge......ofcourse Barker was a messiah -what do you call the chase for Blight and Watson before him....messiah hunting to me........Fox was the same..........we always need A hero to get us out of sh!t........before that itself turns to sh!t.

What happened before I lived has no relevence to me. If I lived for the last 100 years I'd be really concerned about the 1 flag. Or even if I worried what other supporters or the media think. What is important is now and the future and if anyone seriously thinks Westaway is considered a messiah, then they are probably exclusive bretheren.

messiah is the buzzword at the moment. Pratt is messiah to blues fans. Terry Wallace and co were messiahs. We are not in the sh!t as you well know, but the curve is looking down.

Westaway (FF) is to the board what Ross Lyon is to the team, a conservative response to a left of centre predecessor. The similarities are eerie.

[aussierules0k]

[Richter]

Good grief. I hardly see Westaway marketing himself as the great individual saviour. Yes, the ticket is using Nathan Burke's personage to try to...... what..... WIN! Is that so bad? I don't think so.

No doubt most on here are praying that this new lot can bring us success, but most from what I can see most are not expecting miracles, just a bit better than we have done so far. A few may have gone overboard and be blind to the potential negatives of a new board, sobeit, it's football and from time to time we can be allowed to put our hopes in blind faith.

However, it is the same primitive mentality that will hysterically label a person an "incompetent gorilla" after 5 minutes. Denigration and idealisation are two sides of the same coin after all.

What's the point of being high-minded and asking people to submit financial plans (reasonable) if in the next sentence you ignorantly label them as useless apes (idiotic)?

[meher baba]

The only Messiah I have been reading about on here over the past 12 months from some posters is Ross Lyon: how he is going to bring in "modern football" tactics that take us to a flag, how he is going to ensure that every player we get in the draft - even with our third round draft picks - will be an all-Australian, how we will never have any injury problems ever again, etc., etc.

[rodgerfox]

So do you think anyone who has reservations about the new messiahs will rejoice if the whole thing falls on it arse?

Fair Dinkum. You think our egos are so big that to prove an internet point we would be happy if our fears are realised?

Thats right i would be wrapt for the club to go down the s.hitter so I could proclaim some kind of moral internet victory

God help us and our poor rabble of a club.

Does anyone really see SFF as 'messiahs' though?

I think alot of people simply realise that under this current board we are heading downhill and we need change.

No messiahs, no 'second coming', no 'take us to the promised land', just the need to change.

What we have in place on-field is fine - it's just that we're covering that large cracks with sticky tape off it.


Joffaboy, you are getting sucked in big time by the press on this one.

[bungiton]

I'm sick of all the BS on this subject.

Every thread is full of half truths and innuendo.

Yesterday I rang and spoke to Greg Westaway. To me he is an up-front, honest and sincere type of bloke.

I contacted him to ask if with all the shite being posted here, along with valid criticims, I asked if he could register and talk to us here tonight, to which he immediately agreed.

Sadly he contatcted me later to apologise that because this was a public and unofficial forum, he was instructed to renege on the deal he made with me.

During our conversation I asked questions pertinent to the major attacks his detractors are posting on here.

We spoke regarding the issue of Burkie being the public face of the SFF campaign, He informed me that Burkie was sick to the guts in his period as a player and member of the coaching staff, regarding the facilities and services available for players. The playing group had nowhere near the resources needed to be competitive in this competition. Also Greg is a very private individual who highly values his privacy, He is sacrificing a lot to lead this ticket. A man who values obscurity to give his privacy up to run for a fanciful ticket for his own worth, I think not.

I spoke of the concerns raised by Joffaboy about how they were going to start a flood of unfunded spending. This is one area the new ticket are certainly not going to go blindly or spend just for the sake of spending.

They do have detailed plans for where monies will be spent as well as detailed plans for increasing memberships, sponsorship and revenue. A number of groups are willing to back this ticket with sponsorship on the proviso they are elected. It's interesting that these parties are not approaching the current board, seems sponsorship money is there on the proviso the current board aren't the ones managing it.

I spoke at length to Greg, found him to be very approachable, very dedicated to the saints and not the fiend he is being portrayed by the media or sections of this board. I get the impression he would rather not be doing this, after all he stressed a few times during our conversation how much he values his privacy, he's gotten to the point a lot of people had arrived at long before the challenge appeared, being that the current board was fractured, stagnating and innefective, with little vision for the future and that change was neccessary for this club to go forward.

If you get the opportunity, hat to the man, you'll realise his ambition is for the club, the people assembled for this challenge are dedicated proffessionals hoping to raise this club further than the pathetic infighting and rubbish it was presented with this year.