Denis Pagan on 3AW yesterday ...

[Oh When the Saints]

Denis made some interesting comments about St Kilda on 3AW yesterday.

Basically he said our fitness levels were well below par, and that in his opinion St Kilda can be a top 4 side next season simply by getting fitter.

He didn't seem to think there were any dramatic problems with the coaching/list etc., but just that the players were not fit enough to sustain a performance over four quarters, and that this had cost St Kilda a finals berth in 2007.

Also said that Peter Mulkearns will do a fantastic job (may have been talking up a mate here!), and that when Mulkearns was at the Kangaroos they had an excellent last quarter record and a good record with soft tissue injuries.


Only Pagan's opinion, but I thought it sounded pretty positive.

[TheBabyBlues]

Don't want to spoil you party here, but Pagan was pretty positive he had the goings on at Carlton under control too.

Always confident we'd 'turned the corner' and all those other cliches.

Pagan was basically forced to fire Mulkearns and Elshaug as it was a power move by the club who had to be seen to be doing 'something' at the time. That was cheaper than sacking Pagan and was justifiable.

So Mulkearns should do a good job for you, but i wouldn't get excited about Pagans assessment of your list and finishing position as his track record of late is plain awful.

[ausfatcat]

Don't want to spoil you party here, but Pagan was pretty positive he had the goings on at Carlton under control too.

Always confident we'd 'turned the corner' and all those other cliches.

Pagan was basically forced to fire Mulkearns and Elshaug as it was a power move by the club who had to be seen to be doing 'something' at the time. That was cheaper than sacking Pagan and was justifiable.

So Mulkearns should do a good job for you, but i wouldn't get excited about Pagans assessment of your list and finishing position as his track record of late is plain awful.

true but he couldn't come out and say the carlton list is crap after having them for fours could he? He didn't have to say anything about the saints list 9positive or negative).

BTW fitness is exactly what I have been saying for the last 2 months.

[saintsrus]

Don't want to spoil you party here, but Pagan was pretty positive he had the goings on at Carlton under control too.

Always confident we'd 'turned the corner' and all those other cliches.

I value his opinion re the saints, but he was Paid 600k to be positive about the blues.

The question is Ive heard this from other sources too re us being not fit enough, whats the reason?

[TheBabyBlues]

Don't want to spoil you party here, but Pagan was pretty positive he had the goings on at Carlton under control too.

Always confident we'd 'turned the corner' and all those other cliches.

I value his opinion re the saints, but he was Paid 600k to be positive about the blues.

The question is Ive heard this from other sources too re us being not fit enough, whats the reason?

Fair points i guess. But don't you both consider his opinion compromised to the fact he is talking up a mate by saying what he is?

FWIW, perhaps your fitnes issues are simply due to all the injuries you've had over the years and the lack of injury free pre-seasons. Without that solid base to work with, its hard to catch up to the other sides who have had regular, quality pre-seasons.

[meher baba]

It is possible that new fitness staff could help at the margins (although was there anything that much wrong with Starch? He seemed to go ok at the Lions).

But surely there are other causes for our current tendecy to become listless and seemingly lose the capacity to use basic skills like accurate kicking in the second half of games?

What our Carlton interloper friend has to say about our injury-prone preparation to seasons is surely a big part of the problem.

As I have stated in other posts, I am also worried about the way our current match plan seems to run some players into the ground (eg, compare Joey's and Riewoldt's first and second half efforts throughout the season). And I also don't think the coaching staff have gotten the rotation of players off the bench quite right (although here injuries haven't helped much as well). In some games, the composition of our bench has been a bit peculiar: we don't seem to stack it with midfielders like other clubs do.

When TV stations do the "Key Legs" stats before the fourth quarter of our matches, we never ever seem to have an advantage over our opponents.

This all needs to be sorted out IMO.

[Oh When the Saints]

It is possible that new fitness staff could help at the margins (although was there anything that much wrong with Starch? He seemed to go ok at the Lions).

Yep. He abandoned the club halfway through a pre-season that fell to bits and caused a mass of soft-tissue injuries.

But surely there are other causes for our current tendecy to become listless and seemingly lose the capacity to use basic skills like accurate kicking in the second half of games?

What our Carlton interloper friend has to say about our injury-prone preparation to seasons is surely a big part of the problem.

Yep ... there are a whole host of reasons.

One is definitely fitness.

The way Lyon wants the group to play requires much a higher level of fitness.

Better fitness allows you to concentrate better, execute your skills better and gives you more confidence.

A friend of mine is an avid Cats supporter, and knows an assistant coach at Geelong, and he reckons the main reason the Cats have improved this year is that they are a lot fitter, and the new fitness staff have made the group more conditioned.

Lyon ain't going to change the way he wants us to play ... so if it is going to work and we are going to be successful, we need to get fitter.

And I also don't think the coaching staff have gotten the rotation of players off the bench quite right (although here injuries haven't helped much as well). In some games, the composition of our bench has been a bit peculiar: we don't seem to stack it with midfielders like other clubs do.

When TV stations do the "Key Legs" stats before the fourth quarter of our matches, we never ever seem to have an advantage over our opponents.

This all needs to be sorted out IMO.

We can't stack it with midfielders ... we don't have any.

Agree that some of our rotations have been poor ... I would put that down to an inexperienced coaching panel, which is not an excuse in itself, but an unfortunate result of having new people around.

[stinger]

Don't want to spoil you party here, but Pagan was pretty positive he had the goings on at Carlton under control too.

Always confident we'd 'turned the corner' and all those other cliches.

Pagan was basically forced to fire Mulkearns and Elshaug as it was a power move by the club who had to be seen to be doing 'something' at the time. That was cheaper than sacking Pagan and was justifiable.

So Mulkearns should do a good job for you, but i wouldn't get excited about Pagans assessment of your list and finishing position as his track record of late is plain awful.

and your opinion around here is worth jack sh!t...............

[meher baba]

We can't stack it with midfielders ... we don't have any.

This was certainly the case until a few weeks ago, but we have continued to play with IMO at least one midfielder too few while leaving the likes of Thommo, Armitage, Howard and McQualter and, in one game, Birss on the sidelines.

I accept that Lyon does not rate Thommo or McQualter and doesn't see Armitage or Howard as being ready to play AFL yet (if ever): otherwise we wouldn't have been seeing so much of Messrs Attard and Jones, or of Leigh Fisher in the midfield FFS!!

Anyway, let's hope that BJ comes back strongly next year and Armitage and Howard come on in the pre-season and give us some other midfield options. And please no more Jones!!

[stinger]

We can't stack it with midfielders ... we don't have any.

This was certainly the case until a few weeks ago, but we have continued to play with IMO at least one midfielder too few while leaving the likes of Thommo, Armitage, Howard and McQualter and, in one game, Birss on the sidelines.

I accept that Lyon does not rate Thommo or McQualter and doesn't see Armitage or Howard as being ready to play AFL yet (if ever): otherwise we wouldn't have been seeing so much of Messrs Attard and Jones, or of Leigh Fisher in the midfield FFS!!

Anyway, let's hope that BJ comes back strongly next year and Armitage and Howard come on in the pre-season and give us some other midfield options. And please no more Jones!!

geary and eddy will probably be added for next year......both good midfielders..hope they have a good final series with casey....