Dont blame Umpire/Game plan or any other dribble.....

[Teflon]

That ridiculous 50m penalty didn't help.

Fact is WCE are the benchmark.
We came up short.
But not by much.
And with players missing.

So I totally disagree with posters saying we are not worthy of making the 8.
We can still make it.
And if so we can still do some damage in the first 2 weeks.

Facts are they had matchwinners missing also and the best player in the comp on 1 leg.

Facts are we let go of a 4 goal lead and lost by 8 pts....thats a 5 goal turn around.

Facts are you dont win finals under pressure playing 2 qtrs of football and trening up your toes in the last.

[Life Long Saint]

Fact is that the 50m penalty was there!

Stupid play by Vossy then. Absolutely no need to drag the player to the ground. Gifted them a goal.

Not that it would have mattered...we have to be THE worst side I've seen at killing the ball on the last line of defence. WCE got too many goals tonight because we could not force the behind. Not sure if that's a coaching directive or the players initiative. Either way we need to make sure we obtain that skill for next season.

[Dan Warna]

good enough talent

not good enough between the ears.

IMO we choked under pressure and made mistakes.

we have enough talent.

getting more players or different players wont help unless we can maintain discipline.

we played exciting footy for 1/2 a game, and let ourselves down but muffing the ball.

adn they all did it.

reiwoldts decision making to pass 20m in front of goals, birss terrible kicking, fiora shanking a couple, trying to mark balls instead of spoiling.

it was pure discipline in the second half?

talent we have in aces, discipline we sadly lacked.

[Teflon]

good enough talent

not good enough between the ears.

IMO we choked under pressure and made mistakes.

we have enough talent.

getting more players or different players wont help unless we can maintain discipline.

we played exciting footy for 1/2 a game, and let ourselves down but muffing the ball.

adn they all did it.

reiwoldts decision making to pass 20m in front of goals, birss terrible kicking, fiora shanking a couple, trying to mark balls instead of spoiling.

it was pure discipline in the second half?

talent we have in aces, discipline we sadly lacked.

Nup. Sorry to dissapoint you Dan but your hero - GT - said it beautifully tonight on SEN - THE LIST HAS BEEN OVERRATED FAR TO LONG..(but what would he know right?)

Yeah sure...top 6 are super talents.....falls away verty badly after that if you manage to take of the rose colored glasses....

might add....I do enjoy the "Lyon" pressure game plan that will hold us in good stead in 08

[saintsRrising]

Have to disagree Dan...discipline was the one thing which was outstanding for most of the game by most players....

The players stuck to their game plan and work hard..

What let us down was at times sloppy disposal...disciplin was good.

what also cost us was an awesome game by Cox gifting the ball to his mids....and an awesome second half by Cousins.

[Teflon]

Fact is that the 50m penalty was there!

Stupid play by Vossy then. Absolutely no need to drag the player to the ground. Gifted them a goal.

Not that it would have mattered...we have to be THE worst side I've seen at killing the ball on the last line of defence. WCE got too many goals tonight because we could not force the behind. Not sure if that's a coaching directive or the players initiative. Either way we need to make sure we obtain that skill for next season.

you wouldnt hang the loss on it...but soon as it happened I thought.......why would you do that Voss.....and then it hit me....he had to.....if he didnt hold him up and he ran off....Voss knew he couldnt go with him,.,.....

[Dan Warna]

how many times did they try to mark instead of spoil?

poor disposal is poor discipline.

some of the field kicking was ordinary to say the least.

the pressure and attack on the ball and man was good though. that aspect of the game they seemed to keep up for much of the game.

Im making no comment on cousins.

very dissapointing game.

that said the players endeavour was there, and that was good.

[Teflon]

poor disposal is poor discipline.

your clucthing at straws.

poor disposal = poor disposals and a basic lack of skill.

[brown-coat]

good enough talent

not good enough between the ears.

Isn't that a contradiction. I always classify talent as being good between the ears. Having the mind to not kick it to the opposition.

[Liam_G]

good enough talent

not good enough between the ears.

Isn't that a contradiction. I always classify talent as being good between the ears. Having the mind to not kick it to the opposition.

Unsure how Dan is defining that one, but I see it as, They have the skills (talent) but are not always smart at using said skills (between the ears).

[redwhite&blackblood]

50 on Voss was definitely there it showed that the game has passed Vossy it is way to quick for him now. Umpires McBurney and Allen are crap they didn't cost us the game but with their assistance it made it very hard to win.

Why would RL put Blake on Cousins for the entire game? i can't work that move out.

Doc Clarke whilst a good tap ruckman was never going to have the legs to run around the ground with Cox or Seaby and we basically play 1 man down when he is on the ground.

Raph is under so much pressure to play well that he is nervous every time he gets the ball and makes very costly errors in judgment Will be better in time i hope.

In the essence we stopped doing the things that gave us the lead at Qtr time for the last 3 qtrs with out that pressure they were always going to over run us.

[Sam23]

Maguire
Clarke R
Clarke M
Blake
Fisher S
Ball

all had there pants ABSOLUTELY pulled down tonight

S.Fisher?

How exactly....smashed Hansen who is in top form.

Get a clue.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

last night was simply put a top 4 side beating a top 8 side
there were pleanty of possitives to the game but cause we lost they will be forgoton by all on here

in all honesty i though we played well pretty much all night but were beaten by a better team its not like we tryed to defend our lead and go over ran we stuck to the game and then got over ran our third was bad but we all knew WC were not going to lets us have the entire game they were going to come at us hard and they did we just dont have the team to be able to stop that , thats why they have last years flag and we finnished 8th last year

[meher baba]

last night was simply put a top 4 side beating a top 8 side
there were pleanty of possitives to the game but cause we lost they will be forgoton by all on here

in all honesty i though we played well pretty much all night but were beaten by a better team its not like we tryed to defend our lead and go over ran we stuck to the game and then got over ran our third was bad but we all knew WC were not going to lets us have the entire game they were going to come at us hard and they did we just dont have the team to be able to stop that , thats why they have last years flag and we finnished 8th last year

It took a while for some sense to emerge in this thread (with an honourable mention for Enrico Misso earlier).

As for the rest: whinge, whinge, whinge about the list, the players' skills, efforts, etc.

The players absolutely ran themselves into the ground last night. I agree, some of our 22 last night aren't up to the standard required for a top 4 team: Birss, Raph (perhaps will get there, but not yet), Ferguson, Voss (I have to admit after last night, he really does look past it now), M Clarke, perhaps Blake (borderline AFL standard IMO), Attard, etc.

But these were the second stringers. We were missing BJ, Baker, Max and Harves last night and had Ball and X (and, I suspect, Fraser G) playing on one foot (and, of course, we were missing Hamill and Gardiner, but perhaps they don't count). Sure the Eagles were missing/got reduced performances from Kerr and Judd, but their defence and forward lines were basically in tact, and their midfield depth is extraordinary.

The Eagles are a great and powerful team: to me, they looked far better than they were last year and - even without Kerr and with limited value from Judd - I would back them to wallop most of the other contenders in the forthcoming finals series: only Geelong look seriously better to me, and I still wonder about their mental toughness come the big games.

Yes, it's disappointing that we lost. But we played well. Regrets are fine, but seriously bagging anyone - coach, players, club - is not really fair on this occasion IMO.

[barks4eva]

Every week we gift the opposition easy goals, EVERY WEEK

Third quarter our players seem incapable of tapping the ball through for a behind, allowing the ball to remain live and thus gifting a goal to the opposition

Happened against Collingwood, Carlton and again last night

Fiora's turnover, was never an option

Ferguson's free kick that eventually turned into a West Coast free kick for dropping the ball


These three goals were all from basic skill errors or dumb decision making and these three goals enabled West Coast back into the game


The first goal in West Coast's run was the not tapping it through for a behind> M.Clarke responsible AGAIN amongst others, I believe

This is what eventually cost us the game

Every week we gift easy goals to the opposition and it is costing us big time

The fact that we had Blake, Birss and M. Clarke in our midfield for much of the third quarter, didn't exactly do us any favours to put it mildly

We lost the quarter by 28 points

Obviously we lack pace in the midfield and this is where we again got exploited

We need to fix our list quick smart because we have too many passengers and liabilities

Birss is a total liability
Blake is a liability

We need some extra class that unfortunately due to poor recruiting and incompetent list management from the previous football department, right here, right now we just do not have it

[Spinner]

Blame a side that I watched first hand tonight who COULD NOT hit a target in the second half (3rd particulalry).

Its time we faced facts - we simply have some players when the heat is on who dont have the polish and in some cases poise to deliver the football. To drop your bundle, your intensity (was great in first half and Eagles couldnt handle it) like we did in the 3rd is pathetic.

NO amount of miracle move from the coaches box or dumb umpire decision (and there were plenty of them) was going to change the facts that our side goes forward 3 times only to kick the ball out on the full????????????????? OR put it at the feet of Riewoldt and NEVER give our forwards the chance by kicking it to advantage like Lynch got most of the night (how many times did he simply lead out and slide into a ball on his chest?????????)

F@rk me! talk about frustrating....I watch a Joey drill the footy out on the full...I watch a Gilbert scream into fwd 50 and dribble it along the ground.....I watch Leigh Fisher pin point a pass...to the opposition...or Raph Clarke take an eternity to dispose of the ball only to bomb it long to 2 Eagle defenders?????...and there were simply to many more of these things which cost us goals against a skillful Premiership side FFS!

I know we can rely on other sides to lose and still make finals yada yada - but ask yourself - does a GOOD side throw away a 4 goal lead and all of a sudden start losing any semblence of basic footballing skill?...or are we carrying some players that would struggle to get games at other clubs?

We had them on toast tonight - and from what I saw it ALL had to do with an inability to execute by foot/hand.

SPOT "f*****" ON


We lost it. Thats why it hurts so bad.

[Oh When the Saints]

Great opening post Teflon.

[JeffDunne]

We need some extra class that unfortunately due to poor recruiting and incompetent list management from the previous football department, right here, right now we just do not have it

How is the previous football dept responsible for Briss or M Clarke?

[barks4eva]

We need some extra class that unfortunately due to poor recruiting and incompetent list management from the previous football department, right here, right now we just do not have it

How is the previous football dept responsible for Briss or M Clarke?

Did I say they were?

The extent of our list problems isn't limited to Birss and M.Clarke

It's reached epidemic proportions

We have possibly the slowest midfield in the AFL and again we got overrun

The poor list development over 5 years under Thomas is why we are in this position

Aside from Gilbert we have very few young kids coming through

Trading away and using so many selections on recycled players and not elevating rookies for five years has left us with little development coming through

Birss was selected before Lyon was appointed> massive mistake> massive mistake by Lyon in continuing to select him, let alone allowing him to run around through our midfield like an ostrich on novocaine

M.Clarke, only useful as a ruck coach imho and a substitute for viagra for Robert Walls, beyond that another mistake in drafting him

If only our list issues were limited to what we did in last years draft

Obviously appointing a new coach in the middle of the draft is not ideal, but full credit to the board for at least exiting out the machiavelian maestro and svengali snakeoil salesman who completely stuffed our list and sent the club back three to four years in our development

For that alone we should all kiss the feet of Rod Butterss

The true test of Lyon in terms of recruiting will be this years trade period where he has had 12 months to evaluate the list

[saint66au]

Well you just pop into your Tardis and fix up the recruiting barks, while the rest of us worry about the future

When you talk about recycled failures, theres always one bloke who gets left out of the discussion eh???

So if we recruit brilliantly this off-season, will you promise never again to use the phrase "the previous football dept"??

[meher baba]

If our list is as bad as you keep telling us B4E - slowest midfield in the comp, etc. - then why are we set yet again to win more than half of our games and possibly still make the finals with yet another horrendous year of injuries, a new coach who doesn't really know what he's doing, etc., etc.?

How do you rate the lists of Carlton or Richmond or even the Bombers or Froe against ours?

[Nick_Dal_Santo = ChAmPiOn]

i was watching the game 2night (scum vs swans) and i must say that was the worst display of umpiring i have seen in a very long time.

swans got the wrong end of the stick 2night.

lets hope the umpires r the same next for the pies as they play adelaide and we want scum to win

[Buckets]

poor disposal is poor discipline.

your clucthing at straws.

poor disposal = poor disposals and a basic lack of skill.

Lol says the man who quotes GT to back his case after bagging the absolute crap out of him and those who thought to stick up for him. Poor disposals = pressure from the opposition. Face it we have the ability, feel angry for the loss but be confident that we have the ability to mix it with the best.